The Vatican Has Fallen

Discussion in 'Church Critique' started by padraig, Dec 31, 2016.

  1. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    Pelosi’s Archbishop, Salvatore Cordileone, has asked everyone to pray and fast for her.
     
    Beth B, Jason Fernando, AED and 4 others like this.
  2. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

    I was reading about the synodal process opened today and I was struck by a statement by Cardinal Mario Grech that the synod's final document could be sent directly to dioceses around the world and not immediately to the pope:

    "He also suggested that the assembly might decide not to submit its final document immediately to the Pope, but to send it instead to dioceses around the world.
    “In this case, the final document would reach the Bishop of Rome, who has always been recognized by all as the one who issues the decrees established by councils and synods, already accompanied by the consensus of all the Churches,” he said."
    https://www.ncregister.com/cna/pope-francis-path-to-2023-synod-on-synodality-faces-3-risks
    it seems to me that in this way the document could be a" letter of manumission" for the heretical German synod to have its own conclusions and decisions.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2021
    Te Deum likes this.
  3. Mario

    Mario Powers

    I just want to remind everyone that this synodal process is three-fold. 2021: Diocesan synods; 2022: Episcopal conference synods; 2023: Universal synod in Rome. All of these synods are supposedly to take place in the fall.

    Safe in the Two Hearts!
     
    Beth B, Jo M and Luan Ribeiro like this.
  4. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

    yes and it is precisely at the conclusion of the universal phase (2023) that Cardinal Grech suggested sending the final document to the dioceses rather than directly to the pope, considering that the German Synod will be concluded in the same year they will certainly use this process of decentralization in decisions of the Church to impose its reforms.
     
    Beth B likes this.
  5. DeGaulle

    DeGaulle Powers

    Beth B, Clare A, Te Deum and 2 others like this.
  6. DeGaulle

    DeGaulle Powers

    Cardinal Turkson's statement is more monstrous, the more I think about it-so monstrous I think it justifies evoking Godwin's Law. Hitler, on this logic, would arguably not have been in a state of sin for promoting and enforcing the Holocaust, with the guilt laid upon those who did the killing in the actual extermination camps. Indeed, it betrays a certain salvation elitism-no matter how high the casualty rate, the little guy at the coalface is the one that gets sent to Hell. The great and the good can organise whatever they wish against the little people, but will not be asked to answer for it. The little ones can go to Hell.

    These words have little or nothing of Christ about them. Today's Gospel featured an elitist of The Lord's own time, the wealthy young man, but Christ wasn't very soft with him, even though this young man was obedient to the Commandments. To the Apostles later, He did suggest that, with His Grace the wealthy might get into Heaven, like a camel through the eye of a needle, but this was presumed to refer to those wealthy who weren't caught up in sin. The Biden camel is going to need a fair bit of shoving if he doesn't change his tune.
     
    Beth B, Clare A, Te Deum and 6 others like this.
  7. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    Words fail me that a Cardinal could be so off the mark.

    A classic case of diabolical disorientation.
     
    Beth B, DeGaulle, Jo M and 7 others like this.
  8. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

    German Synodal Path Dominated by ‘Political Activists’ With ‘Radical Demands,’ Say Two Participants
    According to these anonymous participants the entire German synodal process has been arranged to result in a conclusion that conforms with the perspectives of the heterodox majority in charge.

    [​IMG]
    Georg Bätzing, Chairman of the German Bishops' Conference, addresses the annual reception of the German Bishops in Berlin on Sept. 27. (photo: Fabian Sommer / Pool/AFP via Getty Images)
    Edward Pentin BlogsOctober 14, 2021
    ROME — The Synodal Path of the Catholic Church in Germany is dominated by “indignant laypeople” who are ensuring their “radical demands” are met by making them look more moderate.

    This is according to an assessment written by two anonymous synodal lay participants and shared with Bernhard Meuser, a German Catholic publisher who recently helped found a new lay group critical of the Synodal Path called “Neuer Anfang” (New Beginning — A Manifesto for Reform).

    Meuser, who also founded the YOUCAT Foundation for the New Evangelization in Bavaria, told the Register on Oct. 6 that according to these members of the Synodal Path, the process is an “abuse of the Church, the forcible appropriation of power by liberal forces and their domination of the process.”

    The Synodal Path, which began in January 2020 and is slated to end in 2023, aims to tackle key areas of reform which organizers say have been highlighted by the clerical sex abuse crisis.


    The two disaffected participants shared their comments with Meuser in a question-and-answer format. They wished to remain anonymous because they wanted to continue “to have a say within the process” and did not want “the thread of conversation to break off,” said Meuser, who believes they reflect the full “horror” and “terrible things happening there.”

    The participants began their critique by noting that the Central Committee of German Catholics (ZdK), to which most of the lay participants in the Synodal Path process belong or through which they have been recommended, is made up of “mostly left-liberal functionaries of associations, committees and federations” who are “by no means the entirety of the laity in Germany.”

    The bishops, they added, fall into three groups: those who support the demands of the lay members; a few loyal to the magisterium led by the theological head of the bishops’ conference, Bishop Rudolf Voderholzer; and the majority of the episcopate, “who remain silent and tremble.” Each bishop has only one vote, the same as each lay participant, and the same applies to the speaking time they are allotted.

    The anonymous participants said the atmosphere is “heated, at times extremely tense,” and they describe 90% of the speakers as “indignant lay people.” Their “radical demands” are made to look “more moderate,” they added, and these tend to secure two-to-one majorities.


    “The debate is dominated by trained political activists who know their tools,” they continued. “Slogans are presented, not arguments” and calls are frequently made for “justice.” Homosexual persons, for example, “are excluded from love, forbidden from sexual self-realization,” and “women are banned from the priesthood; laypeople are illegally kept out of power.” The Catholic Church is presented as a “single violation of human rights — a thoroughly unjust institution, the last totalitarian institution in the world.”

    The participants added that the synodal assembly has become “a platform of expressions of hatred of the Church, at least hatred of the sacramentally and hierarchically constituted Church,” and that a “democratically constituted Church” is talked up.

    “The basic constellation is: human rights against the Church, and thus also against the magisterium and the Pope,” they said, adding that “the real victims of abuse have become unimportant.” There is also “no chance” to properly present theological arguments. “It’s all about politics — the violent enforcement of denied ‘Christian rights’ and ‘women's rights.’”

    “The explicit and formal rejection of ‘new evangelization’ is significant,” the anonymous participants added. “It does not belong to the tasks of the reform assembly and even hinders the reform projects.”


    For these two synod informants, behind this Synodal Path is “a total failure of catechesis in the German Church for 50 years,” along with the “simultaneous emancipation of wide circles of academic theology away from the teaching authority of the Church.”

    Despite the non-binding nature of the Synodal Path and the process having no canonical authority, the two members warned of schism. The next synodal assembly, they pointed out, plans to make “binding decisions by majority vote” and they are not optimistic that courageous bishops will oppose them, especially as only a slim majority of the bishops attended the most recent synodal assembly, Sept. 30-Oct. 2.

    “Should the ‘binding resolutions’ come to pass, the schismatic situation is obvious, and the virus of Church schism will spread to other local Churches,” they predicted.

    Their conclusion was that renewal of the Church won’t be possible “without significant efforts to renew catechesis and the catechumenate.”


    Meuser, who has written and published Catholic books such as At the End of the Day: 365 Prayers and Impulses, and contributed to collaborative works such as Mission Manifest: Theses for the Church’s Comeback

    He compared the process to the student rebellions of the late 1960s and early 1970s, when universities were upturned, the “establishment” disgraced and neo-Marxist ideology took control.

    The Synodal Path is headed by Bishop Georg Bätzing, president of both the German Bishops' Conference and the Synodal Path, and Thomas Sternberg, president of the influential ZdK lay committee.

    The Register forwarded some of the participants’ observations to Bishop Bätzing for a response. Matthias Kopp, spokesman for the president of the bishops’ conference, said the bishop “will not comment on those ‘theses.’
    https://www.ncregister.com/blog/ger...sts-with-radical-demands-say-two-participants
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2021
    Beth B, Jason Fernando and DeGaulle like this.
  9. Clare A

    Clare A Powers

    How desperately sad. These German ‘Catholics’ would make very good Protestants as they seem to find common cause with their fellow countryman Luther.

    May God bless the two informants. It must be very hard to listen to such faithless bilge.
     
    DeGaulle, Jo M and Luan Ribeiro like this.
  10. DeGaulle

    DeGaulle Powers

    I think there are many Protestants who would want nothing to do with this. At least this eventually ought to end that obscene flow of money into the German Church.
     
    Clare A likes this.
  11. Whatever

    Whatever Powers

    Who cares? Certainly not the Pope or Bishops. Isn't it all just part of the process that will give the apologists an excuse to pass off the post-synodal document as Pope Francis managing to protect and develop Church teaching by outlining a loving, pastoral approach in the document which more than likely was written long before any Synod was announced?

    Same old, same old dog and pony show we've been treated to since 2013. The few Bishops who actually have some faith will be further marginalised. The apostate Bishops will pretend to be annoyed that the Pope hasn't given in to all the demands while giving a nod and wink to their friends that the Church has taken another step towards dismantling the Deposit of the Faith. The lukewarm majority will set about picking the splinters out of their bums before placing their order for the German version of a Tesla. And their collective conscience will be salved by sending more money to help dioceses in developing nations reduce their carbon footprint.

    Climate change will be the excuse when the stones cry out.
     
    SteveD, Mmary, DeGaulle and 2 others like this.
  12. Beth B

    Beth B Beth Marie

    That’s horrible! Things are getting worse all of the time. I’m sorry this happened to you.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2021
    Mary's child likes this.
  13. Beth B

    Beth B Beth Marie

    Yes, it is a spectacle….designed to make you not want to make a spectacle out of yourself…it happened to me.
     
  14. Beth B

    Beth B Beth Marie

    I’m not aware of that….it’s possible, but for sure she has real problem with a lot of catholic doctrine! Actually, to the point that because of her own actions, she self excommunicated herself. I guess she is still “ identifying “ as a catholic …albeit a ex catholic!
     
    Mary's child and Luan Ribeiro like this.
  15. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

    I remember that Pope Francis once said that for anyone who doubted he was a Catholic he could recite the Creed; this seems to indicate that he rejects the defense of life from conception as a requirement for being a Catholic, since believing in this confession of faith would be sufficient for him; this makes room for false Catholics like Biden, Pelosi to publicly declare themselves Catholics, bypassing dogmas whose denial entails excommunication.
     
  16. Beth B

    Beth B Beth Marie

    Well it’s entirely possible that Biden and Pelosi have long denied that by their conduct they have excommunicated themselves . But no matter, most of the catholic elites totally ignore their anti catholic behavior and roll out the red carpet for these two ex Catholics.
     
  17. Michael Pio

    Michael Pio Archangels

    The look in their eyes appears to tell a story what may be going on.
     
  18. Beth B

    Beth B Beth Marie

    HeavenlyHosts likes this.
  19. Beth B

    Beth B Beth Marie

    Conchita from Garabandal talked about things occurring after a “ synod”…if my memory is correct…?
    Perhaps in the fall of 2023 when the last synod in this process is over? If the synod results in a even more deeply divided church, that might possibly be the catalyst…..
     
  20. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

    it could also be the beginning of the 7 years of tribulation which would end in October 2030 (the year that would complete 2000 years of Christ's death and resurrection according to some Christian historians).
     

Share This Page