The Vatican Has Fallen

Discussion in 'Church Critique' started by padraig, Dec 31, 2016.

  1. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    This is Good Friday, but we must persevere in believing that Sunday is coming.


    http://www.fatimaperspectives.com/oc/perspective986.asp

    The "Pope Emeritus" on Amoris Laetitia: A devastating "no comment."
    by Christopher A. Ferrara
    April 13, 2017

    Ever since Benedict XVI’s mysterious abdication from the papal throne — for which the faithful have received shifting and unsatisfactory explanations — we have heard again and again from Benedict’s personal secretary, Archbishop Georg Gänswein, how “serene” and “peaceful” Benedict is concerning his unprecedented decision. So serene and peaceful, according to Gänswein, that he could not care less about the Bergoglian tumult that has divided the Church as she has never been divided before — concerning a matter of the moral law as basic as the Sixth Commandment.

    As the redoubtable Edward Pentin reports, in an interview with La Repubblica — the umpteenth attempt to assure us that nothing at all was amiss with Benedict’s abdication — Gänswein reveals that Benedict “received a copy of Amoris Laetitia [AL] personally from Francis, in white and autographed” and that “He read it thoroughly, but he does not comment in any way on the content.”

    No comment? That response could not be more telling. If the one and only “Pope Emeritus” in Church history — a novelty Benedict himself invented — will not defend the orthodoxy of AL, his unwillingness to do so cannot be seen as anything but an implicit recognition that its content, particularly the disastrous Chapter 8, is indefensible. Otherwise, why would the “Pope Emeritus” not simply declare that the teaching of his own successor is doctrinally sound? Answer: he will not declare it because he knows he cannot do so honestly.

    Instead, just as Benedict retreated from the Chair of Peter so has he retreated from the chaos that followed in the wake of his abdication. As Pentin recounts, Gänswein “said the former pope is well aware of contrasts [!] made between him and Pope Francis, but does not let them provoke him, and has ‘no intention of entering controversies that feel far away from him.’”

    Far away from him? But Benedict is living in what he himself called “the enclosure of Saint Peter” in his last General Audience on February 27, 2013, the day before his renunciation of “the ministry of the Bishop of Rome” became effective. So, according to Gänswein at least, Benedict has not only renounced the papacy but has also renounced any concern about the state of the Church under Francis! Instead, Gänswein is happy to report (as summarized by Pentin) that “the Pope Emeritus continues to watch the television news at 8pm, receives L’Osservatore Romano, and Avvenire, the Italian bishops’ newspaper, as well as Vatican press releases.”

    So, if we are to believe Gänswein, Benedict is more interested in the evening news than in the ecclesial chaos Pope Bergoglio has provoked, which is “very far” from him, even though he lives in the Vatican as Bergoglio’s neighbor, whom Bergoglio trots out for public display on certain occasions.

    Regarding that chaos, Gänswein will say only that “Certainly he [Benedict] is taking note of the discussion and the different forms in which it has been implemented.” Different forms? We now have a situation in which the reception of Holy Communion by people engaging in adulterous sexual relations they call “second marriages” is still considered a mortal sin in some dioceses, but is now characterized as “mercy” in others, thanks entirely to AL. But as Gänswein would have it, this disaster is “very far” from the Pope Emeritus, who nevertheless remains attentive to “the evening news at 8 pm.”

    I’m not buying it. Something very fishy is going on with these repeated declarations of what Benedict thinks and feels while Benedict himself never speaks directly to the public. I detect the same fishy smell surrounding the whole event of Benedict’s abdication. Or rather, the smell of sulfur.

    I believe we haven’t been told half the story of why we have a Pope Emeritus who abruptly abandoned his office only to be succeeded by a Pope for whom the term “Vicar of Christ” seems — let us be honest about this — spectacularly inapt. I suspect the full story is to be found in the Virgin’s explanation of the apocalyptic vision of the “Bishop dressed in White,” an explanation that surely exists and just as surely has been suppressed by those whose epochal malfeasance the Third Secret very probably indicts.
     
  2. Mac

    Mac "To Jesus, through Mary"

    From the Gainswein interview....On whether he ever regretted dressing in white, his personal secretary said, “It's a question that for him hasn’t and doesn’t arise. It was a natural thing. He does not see problems [with it],” especially as he removed the mozzetta (the short cape that covers his shoulders) and white sash. “For him it is simply a garment as any other,” he said.

    I get the impression he is the Bishop dressed in White.
    The problem with that is the children have the impression that He is the Holy Father.
    We are a few weeks away from this hoped for event....

    May the seven years which separate us from the centenary of the apparitions hasten the fulfilment of the prophecy of the triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, to the glory of the Most Holy Trinity.
    Benedict XVI

    It certainly feels like things are hastening.
    I will be following the first Sunday in May to see if St Januarius blood fails to liquify again.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2017
  3. Mac

    Mac "To Jesus, through Mary"

    “He read it thoroughly,” Archbishop Gänswein said, “but he does not comment in any way on the content.

    If he supported it, he would have been rolled out for sure.
     
    DivineMercy, Don_D and BrianK like this.
  4. davidtlig

    davidtlig Guest

    Christopher Ferrara continues to clutch at straws. For those who are tempted to do the same, may I just point out that the Pope Emeritus did not say "no comment" to a query about AL. To quote Archbishop Ganswein, Benedict "is not commenting on it in any way." A rather big difference although probably lost on those who continue to hope that the Pope Emeritus does not share Pope Francis' beliefs.
     
    Dean likes this.
  5. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    If we get to the first Sunday in May!!!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-39604361
     
    Mac likes this.
  6. Mac

    Mac "To Jesus, through Mary"

    Its not Chris that is clutching at straws davidtlig.

    Which one do you believe?....http://www.fatimaperspectives.com/oc/perspective694.asp


    I bet you buy this:D:D"I continue to wear the white cassock and kept the name Benedict for purely practical reasons," he writes. "At the moment of my resignation there were no other clothes available.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2017
  7. davidtlig

    davidtlig Guest

    Pope Francis visits Benedict XVI to wish him a happy birthday
    [​IMG]
    Pope Francis, right, talks with Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI in the former Convent Mater Ecclesiae at the Vatican, Saturday, Nov. 19, 2016)

    On April 12 Pope Francis visited his predecessor Pope emeritus Benedict XVI at Vatican City’s Mater Ecclesiae monastery to honor two joyous occasions: the occurrence of Benedict XVI’s 90th birthday and the celebration of Easter which this year fall on the same day, April 16.

    ROME - Early Easter greetings and birthday wishes were the reason for Pope Francis’s visit with Pope emeritus Benedict XVI on Wednesday.

    Following his annual custom, Francis visited his predecessor at Vatican City’s Mater Ecclesiae monastery on April 12 to extend his greetings ahead of Easter Sunday. The Vatican Press Office said the visit had “a double celebratory character” given that Benedict XVI’s 90th birthday, April 16, falls on Easter this year.
    According to Benedict XVI’s closest aide, his advanced age hasn’t yet created any truly serious health challenges aside from a basic problem with walking without assistance.

    “Pope Benedict is in good shape,” said German Archbishop Georg Gänswein, the Prefect of the Papal Household for Pope Francis and also private secretary to Pope Benedict.

    “What bothers him most are his legs,” Gänswein said in a brief interview with Vatican Radio, “so he uses a walker for help, and he gets along very well.”

    “Otherwise, he’s quite clear in his head, and quite bright,” he said. “He participates in everything. He reads, he prays, he listens to music, and he has visitors.

    “Every day he takes a little walk while praying his rosary, so he’s doing the same thing he did at the beginning of his time as the pope emeritus,” Gänswein said.

    The Vatican stamp and coin office also celebrated the pope emeritus’s birthday with the release of stamps marking important events in the life of the church spanning almost 2,000 years.

    The Philatelic and Numismatic Office said the stamp sheet celebrating Pope Benedict’s April 16 birthday was designed to “offer our affectionate tribute to him.”

    Designed by the artist Daniela Longo, the sheet features a drawing of Pope Francis and Pope Benedict embracing, while the actual stamps show the retired pope praying his rosary.

    Benedict XVI sends birthday greetings to Pope Francis every December 17. Last December, on Pope Francis’s 80th birthday, the Pope emeritus sent a “very affectionate” written message that was “particularly appreciated” by the current pontiff, the Holy See press office said.

    That December day, the Pope emeritus also sent three small gifts and made a personal phone call to his successor.

    Crux staff also contributed to this report.

    https://cruxnow.com/vatican/2017/04/15/pope-francis-visits-benedict-xvi-wish-happy-birthday/
     
  8. Mac

    Mac "To Jesus, through Mary"

    I have to assume david has me on the ignore list. He never answers a fair question.
     
    BrianK likes this.
  9. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    I suspect there's a "YUGE" difference between what is presented for public consumption and the "prisoner of the Vatican" reality.

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/201...pope-francis-benedict-never-talk-one-another/

    EXPLOSIVE REPORT From The Vatican: Pope Francis And Benedict “Never Talk To One Another”
    Joshua Caplan Mar 23rd, 2017 8:13 pm 114 Comments

    Many conservatives in America and around the world are at odds with Pope Francis’ Leftist politics. It appears his predecessor, now Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, is not a fan of the current Pope’s strong personality.

    Translated from a German report by Pewsitter.com:

    Speaking at a March 16th conference in Limburg, Germany, the long-time Vatican correspondent Andreas Englisch has delivered an explosive allegation: In contradiction of public appearances, Pope Francis and Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI “are in complete disagreement” and “never speak to one another.” The Pope Emeritus has apparently stated that he only appears in public “at the explicit request of Pope Francis.” What is shown on these occasions, Englisch continues, is “only the pretense of friendship.”

    No official transcript of the press conference is yet available, but Giuseppe Nardi, another well-known Vaticanist who was in attendance, says that Englisch continued his statements by describing Pope Francis as a “strong personality” who “gets what he wants,” and that he has little in common with Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI but “uses him when necessary for the optics.”

    Follow Josh Caplan on Twitter at @JoshDCaplan
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 15, 2017
    Mac likes this.
  10. Denise P

    Denise P Archangels

    Could someone have at least combed Benedict's hair for the photo?
     
    Mac likes this.
  11. davidtlig

    davidtlig Guest

    The absurd views of Andreas Englisch might sell him a few more books and they certainly provide fodder for the anti-Francis bloggers out there but they have no connection with reality.

    Nevertheless, the above page contains the beautiful video clip of Benedict speaking about Pope Francis which I had not previously seen. Here it is:

     
  12. Mac

    Mac "To Jesus, through Mary"

    Emeritus Benedict has made his decision years ago.[he could not win as visible pope]

    We can expect nothing more.
    He will keep silent and climb the mountain.
    His own words.
     
    Pray4peace and SteveD like this.
  13. SteveD

    SteveD Powers

    It is uncharitable to accuse people of 'continuing to hope that the Pope Emeritus does not share Pope Francis' beliefs'. Many of us desperately wish that their views were 'in tune', but this is clearly is not the case in some important matters. Pope Benedict encouraged the Latin Mass, Pope Francis is on record as wondering why anyone but the old would want it and certainly did his best to discourage it in his own archdiocese in opposition to Benedict (in fact he banned it quite illicitly outside of the Cathedral and permitted a once a mid-week celebration in a crypt which was cancelled for lack of support!). If we read AL and then Pope Benedict's recorded views on marriage, we can see clear differences. Pope Benedict criticised Islam at Regensburg and the then Cardinal was recorded as severely criticising Benedict for doing so (it's a 'religion of peace' don't you know!). Scalfari, Francis' great friend and atheist socialist, is either a liar or has accurately reported the Pope as believing that there is no eternal punishment for anyone and that the worst that could happen is that a non-believer is 'annihilated', I can't imagine that Benedict shares that view and, if he does, I should have great fears for both of their spiritual states. I don't recall Benedict deforming the Holy Thursday liturgy by washing the feet of non-Christians before whom he kneels while not being able to kneel at the Consecration of the Blessed Sacrament (not something I imagine for one moment that Benedict, or most Catholics would approve.) We don't need to wonder whether they agree, we know that they don't.
     
  14. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    Exactly, thank you. David is dreaming to assert they are in agreement. It's a refusal to acknowledge reality and a serious danger to the faithful.
     
  15. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    There's not a thing absurd about it. Pope Francis is diametrically opposed to numerous matters that BXVI held dear and wrote about (see SteveD's post above), even rehabilitating the execrable Kasper, who BXVI long battled and thankfully silenced.

    Your statement is false and a clear and present danger to the faithful. Take your nonsense elsewhere.
     
    Mary's child and Mac like this.
  16. davidtlig

    davidtlig Guest

    It is clear that Pope Francis and the Pope Emeritus are very different people with very different approaches. When I say that they share the same beliefs I am referring to fundamental beliefs. Benedict certainly likes the Latin Mass more than Francis but this hardly conflicts with my basic statement. Benedict's Regensburg address was a mistake for which he later apologised. Both Pope and Pope Emeritus have the same approach to interfaith dialogue.

    The bottom line is that if Benedict had the same beliefs as the critics of Francis have on this forum, he would not show the love and friendship to Francis that he has done.
     
  17. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

     
    SteveD likes this.
  18. Richard67

    Richard67 Powers

    It's homilies like the Holy Father's Easter Vigil Homily that remind me that the Vatican has NOT fallen:

    “After the Sabbath, as the first day of the week was dawning, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb” (Mt 28:1). We can picture them as they went on their way… They walked like people going to a cemetery, with uncertain and weary steps, like those who find it hard to believe that this is how it all ended. We can picture their faces, pale and tearful. And their question: can Love have truly died?

    Unlike the disciples, the women are present – just as they had been present as the Master breathed his last on the cross, and then, with Joseph of Arimathea, as he was laid in the tomb. Two women who did not run away, who remained steadfast, who faced life as it is and who knew the bitter taste of injustice. We see them there, before the tomb, filled with grief but equally incapable of accepting that things must always end this way.

    If we try to imagine this scene, we can see in the faces of those women any number of other faces: the faces of mothers and grandmothers, of children and young people who bear the grievous burden of injustice and brutality. In their faces we can see reflected all those who, walking the streets of our cities, feel the pain of dire poverty, the sorrow born of exploitation and human trafficking. We can also see the faces of those who are greeted with contempt because they are immigrants, deprived of country, house and family. We see faces whose eyes bespeak loneliness and abandonment, because their hands are creased with wrinkles. Their faces mirror the faces of women, mothers, who weep as they see the lives of their children crushed by massive corruption that strips them of their rights and shatters their dreams. By daily acts of selfishness that crucify and then bury people’s hopes. By paralyzing and barren bureaucracies that stand in the way of change. In their grief, those two women reflect the faces of all those who, walking the streets of our cities, behold human dignity crucified.

    The faces of those women mirror many other faces too, including perhaps yours and mine. Like them, we can feel driven to keep walking and not resign ourselves to the fact that things have to end this way. True, we carry within us a promise and the certainty of God’s faithfulness. But our faces also bear the mark of wounds, of so many acts of infidelity, our own and those of others, of efforts made and battles lost. In our hearts, we know that things can be different but, almost without noticing it, we can grow accustomed to living with the tomb, living with frustration. Worse, we can even convince ourselves that this is the law of life, and blunt our consciences with forms of escape that only serve to dampen the hope that God has entrusted to us. So often we walk as those women did, poised between the desire of God and bleak resignation. Not only does the Master die, but our hope dies with him.

    “And suddenly there was a great earthquake” (Mt 28:2). Unexpectedly, those women felt a powerful tremor, as something or someone made the earth shake beneath their feet. Once again, someone came to tell them: “Do not be afraid”, but now adding: “He has been raised as he said!” This is the message that, generation after generation, this Holy Night passes on to us: “Do not be afraid, brothers and sisters; he is risen as he said!” Life, which death destroyed on the cross, now reawakens and pulsates anew (cf. ROMANO GUARDINI, The Lord, Chicago, 1954, p. 473). The heartbeat of the Risen Lord is granted us as a gift, a present, a new horizon. The beating heart of the Risen Lord is given to us, and we are asked to give it in turn as a transforming force, as the leaven of a new humanity. In the resurrection, Christ rolled back the stone of the tomb, but he wants also to break down all the walls that keep us locked in our sterile pessimism, in our carefully constructed ivory towers that isolate us from life, in our compulsive need for security and in boundless ambition that can make us compromise the dignity of others.

    When the High Priest and the religious leaders, in collusion with the Romans, believed that they could calculate everything, that the final word had been spoken and that it was up to them to apply it, God suddenly breaks in, upsets all the rules and offers new possibilities. God once more comes to meet us, to create and consolidate a new age, the age of mercy. This is the promise present from the beginning. This is God’s surprise for his faithful people. Rejoice! Hidden within your life is a seed of resurrection, an offer of life ready to be awakened.

    That is what this night calls us to proclaim: the heartbeat of the Risen Lord. Christ is alive! That is what quickened the pace of Mary Magdalene and the other Mary. That is what made them return in haste to tell the news (Mt 28:8). That is what made them lay aside their mournful gait and sad looks. They returned to the city to meet up with the others.

    Now that, like the two women, we have visited the tomb, I ask you to go back with them to the city. Let us all retrace our steps and change the look on our faces. Let us go back with them to tell the news In all those places where the grave seems to have the final word, where death seems the only way out. Let us go back to proclaim, to share, to reveal that it is true: the Lord is alive! He is living and he wants to rise again in all those faces that have buried hope, buried dreams, buried dignity. If we cannot let the Spirit lead us on this road, then we are not Christians.

    Let us go, then. Let us allow ourselves to be surprised by this new dawn and by the newness that Christ alone can give. May we allow his tenderness and his love to guide our steps. May we allow the beating of his heart to quicken our faintness of heart"​

    https://zenit.org/articles/popes-easter-vigil-homily-2/
     
    Martina likes this.
  19. Martina

    Martina Pray Hope and don't worry: Padre Pio

    Thank you Richard for posting this. The new dawn will only come after the Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart. Pray today for our Pope that the Holy Spirit fills him with God's word and requests.
    I fear that not enough importance by even the faithful is given to this Consecration, IT IS the only thing that can happen to change what is going on in the world today, there is no good future on this earth without it.
     
    Pray4peace, Julia, Praetorian and 2 others like this.
  20. Mac

    Mac "To Jesus, through Mary"

    I have a big problem with some of the lines in this homily.[can you spot them?]
    But rather than fumble about as I often do and try to discuss, will await expert commentary.
     
    AED, HeavenlyHosts and Malachi like this.

Share This Page