Some thoughts on the Warning of Garabandal

I love that poem, and it is so true. Yes I have also been through worse than what my son is doing...it has taken me 30 years of trial and error and some really emotional confessions along the way to get back on track myself. That is why I pray for him, but am not overly troubled, and I cannot judge...though I certainly can throw my weight as his mom around...and hope he grows up and forward and doesn't take as many steps backward as his mom did. He is in a place that in some ways is better than where I was at his age, so I just hope that he will not take 20 more years to find his right path. If the warning happens that will certainly help him to complete his conversion. He only has to go to confession...and reaffirm his life and start living the Catholic faith more actively again. He is very close, just being that headstrong kid that most of us were. I believe he will be fine. In fact, sometimes I talk to him for my own support and for a fresh view. He can be very understanding and objective, even though he is only 20.

Thank you for that poem, I will send it to him, in fact, and to my daughter too.

 

Sin cannot be judged in human terms but only in light of the holiness of God. We live in a very sinful and secular world that has lost the sense of sin. Sin can only be measured and judged in light of the omnipotent holiness of God.

The warning will be a very painful purification because we are dealing with God who is not only holy but thrice Holy. We can never comprehend the light of God's holiness. When Jesus was transfigured in the light of his holiness, what did the 3 disciples do? They hit the ground in fear and trembling and hid their faces for they were in the presence of absolute holiness. Until Jesus spoke to them and touched them they were unable to stand. Saul when he encountered the holiness of God on the road to Damascus was blinded by a brilliant light and was purged of sin to become Paul - this did not happen overnight because he had to learn from Peter and undergo complete conversion [metanoia].

For those in mortal sin the warning will be a shocking event that will rock them to the core of their being as the warning will affect us body, soul and spirit. satan has a habit of deceiving us that we are all right and not far off the right path - but Christ taught the opposite - he said for example to watch and pray and that should a man even look at a woman lustfully he has already committed adultery in his heart! Thus, every unconfessed sin, either by thought, word, deed or sin of omission will brought to bear before before the awesome holiness of God. Many will collapse in fear like the disciples and like Saul therefore, it will take the grace of God to even come through the warning experience.

 

Good point Garabandal. A friend said some similar things to me today. I think she was chiding me for carrying burdens that are not my alone to carry. I'm going to pray for my friends (I will for us all) but as my friend said "just keeping shining your light on them."
Its been a stressful week and I have to rely on His grace but I'm having trouble with an overabundance of pain going on around me.

Momscalling: I totally related to you when you said you needed to throw your weight around as "Mom". Thats our role- if we don't say something than we passively send approval and thats not good, but when the guidance comes from people who have been around the block a few times (like us)and have empathy for the pain that our children go through when they make a mistake I think they get it. You might ask him to join you at church. We call that "hurtle help"- sort of getting them over the initial anxiety and on the right path. (I need lots of hurtle help at times when it comes to my faith)
I love my kids- they make all sorts of mistakes. I guess I can understand why God loves us so much!

 

Hi Kathleen,
Oh if only he were here to ask, he is in New Mexico with his girlfriend, going to school there. Whenever he does come home we do go to church together. I am not sure where they are going or if they are going at all in NM, but I do know that they talk about religious topics together a lot. She has many spiritual relatives that practice the Jewish faith, so it is an interesting time for him and for them, as they discover what path they are going to go down. I do know this, I asked and they agreed, to have the baby baptized when they come here after he is born. In fact, my son's favorite priest from High school is still close by, and he has a practicing Jewish mother!!! My son asked me to see if I could find him, and I did. This will be the perfect priest to talk to them since he understands Amethyst's upbringing so well too. So things don't look so bleak. They just need to take the next steps as adults, you know? Right now the Hebrew traditions have my son intrigued, and confused. It is very interesting, this year he celebrated passover with her grandmother. Amethyst has two grandmothers, an aunt, and a great grandfather all living close by, and my son has taken full advantage of their age and wisdom...they have many talks together. But where will it lead them...that is the question. They will be a good "project" for Fr. Ray, the priest that is half-jewish. I just hope he hits it off well with Amethyst. I am blessed to have someone like him nearby to help.

Both of my kids will go to church with me if I ask them to, when I visit them or when they visit us. It is just getting them to go on their own that is the struggle of the day...and getting them to find the right path with their own significant others who now influence them more than I do - as they grow up and way from my "mommy strings".

 

The baptism is a great place to start.
Subtle hints and humble guidance- Thats what I always feel like I'm doing with my husband and co-workers. Husband is still a protestant and my co-workers are still unchanged also. I wish I had a good answer.

My parents were no great at giving guidance. They never talk about their faith (which actually made me confused and angry for awhile since I felt like they missed the boat when I was young- now I realize that they were not understanding what was going on either, until recently.) Mom has shared a few books on Mary over the years- which was how I got "hooked on Mary." My Dad got me the Medjugorje Magazine last year which I thought was very sweet.

I'll pray for your son and his new family, that you find the right opportunity and that the right words come.
Amethyst sounds beautiful,
Kath

 

I think its a bit like an automobile travelling along a highway. The faster its going in one direction the harder it is to suddenly stop as Muirean writes, do a hand brake turn and do a 180 degree turn then go in the reverse direction. If its going too fast it might even crash and burn. For someone steeped in evil its pretty well impossible. Though no one, of course, falls outside the mercy of God.

I think, often of the words of Jesus to Saint Paul at the time of his conversion, 'It is hard for you to kick against the goad.'I think a goad was a little stick used by the driver to control a camel, like an automobiles brakes at the minute.

God is not going to put the brakes on us entirely slowly in fact he is putting them on already with thing like the weather, the economic depression, the volcano's and earthquakes and so on....but the end of the day, with the Illumination of conscience He's really planning on slamming the brakes down really hard, no matter how slowed dwon we may have gotten to by then. But as for folks still travelling at great speed towards Satan when the brakes are pushed full on..well like I say, seat belt or no seat belt there's a good chance they'll go flying through the window or crash and burn as I say. But anyone who is ignoring all the brake pulling that is going on at the minute, I have to say they have to be really closing their eyes very,very hard.

But having the brakes stamped on won't be so easy for any of us.

 

Padraig, you have a brilliant way of describing spiritual things in human terms - I like the analogy of the automobile! We need to be speeding towards God whilst the world is heading in the opposite lane.

 

I agree, Padraig,you have a great way of using a combination of words and pics to get your point across in a way so we get just the right message you are trying to bring to us. My question though is...where do you get all those great pictures!!

Yes, Amethyst (my son's girlfriend) is very pretty - cute as a button. She is also very independant, but young in thinking sometimes, and she is confused as to where she is spiritually. On their Facebook pages, under "Religion", my son proudly displays "Roman Catholic" but on her page, she displays "Let's just not go there". Now, I understood this when I saw it, and I think she really is confused right now. I am sure my son is adding to that confusion too, as he is very educated about religion for a 21 year-old, and he is also very scientific, so he can see religion from several different angles, talk through all of them and then come out content in his own head. But, he can drive another person crazy trying to keep up with his thoughts and analogies (which is why I love debating these things with him - and why my husband hates debating these things with him! Haha). Kathleen, thank you for your prayers, I will be making an appt with that priest my son wants to talk to, who is down in Ottowa now, to get things started. I am looking forward to talking with him myself too...it will help me also.
Amethyst

 

You have made me brave! I am inviting our young priest who is leaving over for dinner. Pray that he will come. My husband has been asking to meet with him. I'm trying not to get too excited but ohhhhh I am.
God Bless you!

Happy Mother's Day!!!!

 

Hi Donna

Praying away for you.

I so hope the Sixth Seal will be broken soon as my father has about three weeks to live and for the healing of yourself. I feel an inner certainty that it will not be long now till, '...........the heavens depart as the as a scroll when it is rolled together', I have been feeling the angels gathering so close the last few days

The increased seismic activity is because a world wide earthquake will accompany the Sign and Illumination.

Rev. 6:12-17.

"And I beheld when He had opened the 'SIXTH SEAL,' and, lo, there was an earthquake: and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood: and the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bond man, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; and said to the mountains and rocks, FALL ON US, and HIDE US from the face of Him that sitteth on the Throne, and from the WRATH OF THE LAMB: for the great day of HIS WRATH is come; and who shall be able to stand?"



Cf: The little know apparitions at Heede , Germany back just before World War 2:

http://www.users.qwest.net/~slrorer/HeedeVisions.htm


"Tremendous things are in preparation; it will be terrible as never before since the foundation of the world. All those who in these grave times have suffered so much are martyrs and form the seed for the new Church. They were privileged to participate in My captivity, in My scourging, in My crown of thorns and My way of the Cross!"

"The Blessed Virgin Mary and all the choirs of Angels will be active during the happenings. Hell believes that it is sure of the harvest, but I will snatch it away from them. Many curse me now, but these sufferings will come over mankind that they may be saved through it . . . Many expiate all they can for those who curse Me now."

" I will come with My peace. With a few faithful, I will build up My Kingdom. As a flash of lightening this Kingdom will come . . . much faster than mankind will realize. I will give them a special light. For some this light will be a blessing; for others darkness. The light will come like the Star that showed the way to the wise men. Mankind will experience My love and My power. I will show them My justice and My mercy. My dearly beloved children, the hour comes closer and closer. Pray without ceasing!"
The Immaculate Mother of God appeared in Heede, Germany from 1937 through 1940. Her pleadings for prayer and penance included warnings about the impending chastisement of God's Justice. While She revealed herself as Mary, Immaculate Queen of the Universe, She also used the title, Queen of the Poor Souls in Purgatory. To emphasize Her plea for more frequent and fervent prayers for the Poor Souls in Purgatory, She appeared in the cemetery of the parish church.

 

A few thoughts on the Warning…
Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, (then) I will enter his house and dine with him, and he with me.
--Revelation 3:20

When I think back on my own adult life, the better part of 20 years of going my own way, I realize there were many times I heard Jesus knocking on the door of my heart. There were even a few times that I opened the door, but I never invited Him in, and I shut the door again. I finally invited Him in only when knowing Him became the most important to me. The problem with secular society today is that people are so caught up in the lies of the world that they don’t even hear God knocking anymore, or else they are happy speeding along in the direction they are going and they simply ignore the knocking. The warning will be a knock that can’t be missed. Sadly, I suppose there will still be those who shut the door in Jesus face.

A few thoughts on religion and science…
I have an education in science, originally in the physical sciences and then biological sciences. When I was young, there seemed to be a contradiction between the scientific view and the Christian view, and sadly there are those in academia who teach that you can’t believe in both: a lie. The more I learned about my faith and the more I learned about science, I came to understand that they actually support each other, not contradict each other. “Religion without science is blind, and science without religion is lame” (Albert Einstein).

A few thoughts on our Jewish brothers and sisters…

You people worship what you do not understand; we worship what we understand, because salvation is from the Jews (John 4:22).

There’s a website that you may find useful:
http://www.salvationisfromthejews.com/

 

I like much of what you said darrell.

I believe that today, in most 1st world societies people are racing, ever more quickly, away from their innate spiritual beliefs as they endeavor to acquire more - money, status, possessions, or a better future for their children. That knock on the door is becoming harder to hear. More and more of a person’s time is spent away from the things that endure – marriage, family and faith. And it is only in our later years, when we try to ascribe a meaning to our lives that we come to realize how foolishly we have spent our time.

For myself, I have invested 13 yrs of education in the sciences. I do not think that science can provide proof of our beliefs. But that is appropriate, for our love for the Almighty should not be based upon a mathematical formula or a scientific experiment.

After all science has never addressed nor will it ever be able to explain the first creative act (the prime mover). By its very nature the first creative act will be beyond science, mathematics, experimentation and explanation.

But a scientific mind helps one understand the deep beauty, order and mechanisms that this physical world exhibits. If there is a creator then the act of creation and what is created must reflect the power, values and intent of the creator.

If examined in that light, then it seems clear to me that this physical world presents certain attributes that illuminates its creator. For instance one wonders why does the world act like a mirror - albeit not a perfectly reflecting one (due to the interaction of everyone’s free will). It acts like a mirror (stimulus response system) so that what we project into it is what is reflected back to us and thus we can learn and grow.

What goes around comes around. Live by the sword and die by the sword - project violence into the world and it gets returned to you. This reflective mechanism (physical world) provides a medium by which we can grow morally, ethically and spiritually.

If this world were about acquiring things then why would it be a zero sum game? After all there can only be rich people at the expense of having the poor. The things that we seemingly want to acquire are limited and our reach for higher status has to be relative to those of a lesser one.

But for each of us growing morally, ethically and spiritually does not require us to take anything away from any other person. Thus the creator’s intent is clearly illustrated by the mechanisms of that which was created.

nonlocality

 

nonlocality,

Sorry it's taken me a few days to get back to you - really busy.

Very well said. I remember once I was in an advanced class on the human neurological systems and as we reviewed the afferent and efferent and alternate pathways, I kept thinking to myself, "We are fearfully and wonderfully made. We are fearfully and wonderfully made." How anyone could ever think such intricate and complex systems could ever evolve purely by chance boggles my mind. But I digress...

Yes. God is love and love does not take. Love is the giving of self to and for others.

Darrell

 

Good insights in this thread - beauty is interwoven into human existence and beauty brings joy. God's awesome nature is reflected in the beauty of his creation the created order but also in the creation of man made in his own image and likeness.

Genesis 1.
26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good.

I have always been intrigued by verse 26 where it says 'Let us make man in our image and likeness' - the plural here suggests Trinity yet God is one [I see the trinity as family of persons Father, Son and Holy Spirit, 3 yet 1]. We are therefore made in God's image; male and female reflecting the trinitarian God. And God saw all that he has made and it was very good that is beautiful. This initial image of God in man was spoiled by original sin and the human soul was distorted by the ugliness of ego and pride. True beauty is restored to the soul through sanctifying grace but not only restored - elevated to an even higher level through co-operation with divine grace at the cost of the precious blood of the Lamb [grace does not come cheap!]. The angel Gabriel pronounced to our Lady that she was 'full of grace' and thus she was all-beautiful. Our Blessed Mother continued to grow in grace and beauty throughout her earthly life in cooperation with the divine and also because she chose to live in union with her Son in her suffering - the seven sorrows of Mary - were offered as acts of perfect love to the triune God perfecting futher her interior beauty as a dwelling place of the Most High. Thus, Mary ranks in beauty above all men and even the angels indeed she radiates beauty and love [Padraig will confirm this as he was blessed to have encountered her in person!].

That is why we are pro-life apostles as we see the beauty of life, the beauty of sacramental marriage, the beauty of love & goodness and the beauty of Christ. Where there is beauty we see God.

In contrast all that is of evil, sin, hatred and the devil is ugly and distorted - the brutality of abortion, the ugliness of impurity etc - the soul in mortal sin is all darkness and ugliness to the degree of attachment to sin [thus in Hell souls are often seen taking the form of distorted and unknown animals].

Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn once stated that - 'Beauty will save the world'

http://www.mro.org/mr/archive/24-2/articles/beauty.html

Beauty did save the world on the tree of the Cross. Christ crucified is beautiful. His wounds are wounds of love.

The 14th century Byzantine theologian, Nicholas Cabasilas wrote, "When men have a longing so great that it surpasses human nature and eagerly desire and are able to accomplish things beyond human thought, it is the Bridegroom who has smitten them with this longing. It is he who has sent a ray of his beauty into their eyes. The greatness of the wound already shows the arrow which has struck home, the longing indicates who has inflicted the wound" (cf. The Life in Christ, the Second Book, § 15). The beautiful wounds, but this is exactly how it summons man to his final destiny. True knowledge is being struck by the arrow of Beauty that wounds man, moved by reality, "how it is Christ himself who is present and in an ineffable way disposes and forms the souls of men" (cf. ibid.).

Pope Benedict also reflects on the beauty of Christ:
Being struck and overcome by the beauty of Christ is a more real, more profound knowledge than mere rational deduction. Of course we must not underrate the importance of theological reflection, of exact and precise theological thought; it remains absolutely necessary. But to move from here to disdain or to reject the impact produced by the response of the heart in the encounter with beauty as a true form of knowledge would impoverish us and dry up our faith and our theology. We must rediscover this form of knowledge; it is a pressing need of our time.

 

I would agree with you Darrell that it is hard to understand how such an ordered, coherent and integrated existence could arise from random chance and disorder. For me it is hard to wrap my scientific mind around the evolutionary argument that organic matter transformed itself into a living, genetically encoded cell. Or even what the physical/biological imperative for that to happen would be. After all, planets and moons which do not support life are still important to this physical creation.

I know evolutionists would point to a phase change (e.g. gas to solid) and say that is an example of disordered to ordered atomic/molecular transition. But that is an inappropriate analogue since they started off with too many a priori assumptions. Because even before there can be matter or energy in any form there has to be a stable context that can support it. Where did that come from?

As I have told my son, if the creative act was performed in a stepwise process then one of the first few steps would have been the creation of a physical context. That is the establishment of space-time (4 space-time or 11 space-time for some string theorists), the force laws, thermodynamic laws, conservation laws, Lagrange’s principle of least action/energy, Pauli’s exclusion principle plus the classical illusions of locality, determinism and causation………….

So to go from a nothingness void to this physical context would require SOMETHING searching through variations and finding stability even in the absence of matter/energy. Because it is only when the physical context becomes ordered, coherent, integrated and stable that matter/energy can be created. This kind of evolutionary process is much harder to explain and is outside the power of our scientific principles and mathematical models. I am unaware of any mathematical model of a zero dimensional, undefined physical context – perhaps it is just the number zero.

For me, I find tremendous beauty in this physical creation. I find it in its order, its integrated nature, its holistic nature, in its variety, the dependencies of the animate upon the inanimate, and in its simplicity. Perhaps beauty is a proof of the Creator, or at least a way of him communicating with us.

I can’t help but look at a beautiful Arizona sunset and feel him speaking to me.

nonlocality

 

Beautifully put. My son and I actually talk like this too sometimes...and to make it all work in our heads is the ultimate scientific gift for inquiring minds....LOL
Carry on! And keep on "playing" those strings! It's all a beautiful song, you know...that's the beauty of the math, and the order, and the harmonics of all the strings...The word, the song, the dimensions, the vibrations, the fabric...I could go on and on...