Dear DeGaulle and all other members of the Forum, How can we get the Holy Father to either rescind or clarify, the Exhortation Amoris Laetitia? How do we go about this? Where do we start? And what should we do? I agree with the gentleman in the video, Mr John Smeaton. I think now that so many have read through the entire AL [which I have not! and even if I had, I would still need to reread it to make sure I had not missed something] but greater minds than I have found it not only lacking and ambiguous but also very dangerous, so surely we should do something! Should we all write a letter to the Holy Office? Or should someone type up a letter and we all counter sign it, somehow? And what Bishops and Priests do we have or need to back up a lay resistance movement to Amoris Laetitia as it stands today? I think as forum members of the MoG site, we should do our little part, that is, do something constructive to uphold our Holy Catholic Faith. What do you or other members think we should or could do [beside prayer] in this regard?
Sorry folks but when I see a post like this I just have to respond by saying, pray - pray for humility. Jesus has given us the Church on earth led by the Pope. Stop reading all the rubbish and recognize the devil is hard at work leading so many 'thinking Catholics' on a dangerous path that ultimately leads to the loss of their Faith.
Well spoken, David. Don't let the Gargoyles grind you down. We know who won in the stand off between David and Goliath. You have already won in this confrontation. If God is with us who can be against. We know God is with us and Our Pope. I don't wish these knaves any harm but I hope God frightens them into submission and real soon.
I assume David and Joe have not read the Exortation. I'm hoping for a St. Paul to step forward and correct St. Peter. Pray.
Joe did you listen to Mr John Smeaton? If so, can you understand why I believe we should seek clarification regarding the AL? My take on what Mr Smeaton says, is that we are indeed faced with a serious situation for the Catholic faith! because of the potential for misinterpretation by many [mainly the young and those searching for the truth] in regards to the teachings of Jesus Himself! I Love Pope Francis and I believe he is being lead by the Holy Spirit but I also think the evil one has him surrounded and is using others to coerce His Holiness's teachings! I think the only thing the Catholic faithful need at this moment is clarification in regards to the divorced and remarried without annulment. These poor people in this situation are searching for God and want to receive Our Lord in Holy Communion and yes they can recieve Jesus in Holy Communion, if first they do the hard yards and seek and recieve an annulment of their first marriage! because without this, they are contravening a law of God, and surely if they love each other, this sacrifice that they should undergo, is something worth going through for the many graces they will recieve and of course for the ultimate ability to recieve Jesus in Holy Communion! I believe the AL needs to be more specific, because so many are confused by it's ambiguity as it stands at the moment but also because I would love the AL to be a sign of hope for all the young in the Church today, who are even now or who will in the future be contemplating the Holy Sacrament of Marriage and family life. I also would like to believe that you and David would be happy with this.
I believe this is a vatican 2 end run to change church teaching. It was obvious from the beginning with the pope trying to stack the committees. The words are beautiful, but open to interpretation. Sound familiar?
Are you kidding? Nothing happened? The big news at that time was planned parenthood selling live aborted baby parts if you remember. What did the moral authority of the world have to say? Nothing. The salt has lost its taste, that is a biblical big deal.
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: ‘We are in the fourth great crisis of the Church’ http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/new...are-in-the-fourth-great-crisis-of-the-church/ For those who see no crisis then the rose tinted glasses need to be removed. (My opinion - the present crisis is the greatest in the history of the Church).
It is a sad state for the church, when people on this blog on the 2016 presidential race, are holding politicians (Donald Trump) to a higher standard than the pope of our church. When you take abortion and homosexuality off the table as Pope Francis has done, all you have is social justice. No matter how good you are at that, FallenSaint and others, why not just be an atheist? The salt has lost its taste, only to be thrown down and trod under foot.
Note that this article is an old one from 6 Jun 2014. It is not a response to the Pope's exhortation. Having said that, the bishop is of course not a supporter of the exhortation but readers should be aware that the crisis, in his view, is 50 years old.
Piccadilly, Why do you continue to bring me into the conversation. I have said my peace. Again I will state...stoping late term abortion by voting Trump is a lot better then voting Hillary. Every Republican on day one has stopped late term abortions. As for you, Brian, Mac and little me...you guys are way to the extreme for me. Constantly bashing our Holy Father...why stay in the Catholic Church. But again I have said my peace. This thread is going nowhere, therefore I stopped participating. Spiritually, I am tired. You guys can try to push your division of the church til you turn blue. Division and discord come from the DEVIL. There, I said it. There is a way to debate and a way to continuously try to divide the church. You and your cohorts continuously try to divide the church. One person even stated all of MOG should start sending letters to the Pope to amend or discard L.A. What Pride...what nonsense. When I saw that I thought to myself...look what this has turned into. It's pretty sad. There is some pretty educated people on this forum but there are also some people who just jump on the bandwagon and pull up any nonsense from the Internet. I've communicated with Athanasious a few times and he wouldn't approve of these tactics. And Saint Padre Pio would not either. Respect for the Holy Father has been lost...thanks to many posts on MOG. That is the sad part of this conversation. Would Our Blessed Mother be happy? I doubt it but we will see soon enough.
Fallen Saint, I support your decision to vote for Trump, not because I like him but because I can't imagine anyone being worse than Clinton. On the issue of AL, I find myself in disagreement with you. We have the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith saying one thing and Cardinals, including the Cardinal the Pope charged with explaining the document, saying something else. They can't all be right and the buck stops with the Pope. It's his duty to clarify the document and put an end to any disagreement about what it means. How are Catholics to get a definitive answer on this? Even asking our bishop won't elicit a definitive answer because the Church is not speaking with one voice on this. That leaves us with no option to find out from the Vicar of Christ. Now, how do we do that? He's unlikely to answer a phone call. I wouldn't hold out much hope of getting an answer to a letter, but I'm open to suggestions if you can think of the best way to find out which of Cardinal Muller, Cardinal Schonborn, Cardinal Kasper or Cardinal Marx has the correct interpretation. I'm editing this to say that I don't for a minute believe that anyone who is either happy or unhappy with this document is a better or worse Catholic than me. We're all sinners trying to do our best.
Let the Holy Spirit work...your answer is not going to happen over night. It may take 50 to 100 years. Trust the Holy Spirit. Read Our Holy Fathers homilies...that is what he is doing. The question is...do you trust Holy Spirit.
I trust the Holy Spirit. Right now, the Holy Spirit appears to be saying different things to different Bishops. My problem is that if the Holy Spirit is inspiring Cardinal Kasper, then the Holy Spirt appears to be contradicting Himself, so there's something wrong. Time for the Pope to clear things up. How do you know that the Holy Spirit isn't inspiring us to ask for the clarification?
The crisis is older than 50 years old but has certainly accelerated from 1960. Having read AL several times it is much too long winded and saturated by situation ethics. Hence, much of it is open to different interpretations by different readers. This is clear in the many different responses that there have been to different parts of the document. Many greater minds than mine have been equally confused. I don't expect Pope Francis to clarify anything because he doesn't seem to mind stirring the pot - "Make a mess, but then also help to tidy it up. A mess which gives us a free heart, a mess which gives us solidarity, a mess which gives us hope." What is the definition of moral ambiguity? doubtfulness or uncertainty of meaning or intention: to speak with ambiguity; anambiguity of manner. 2. an unclear, indefinite, or equivocal word, expression, meaning Of course, my post will be viewed as 'anti-Pope Francis' which I am not. I am pro-clarity. Those who are leaders of any organisation have a duty to communicate clearly and to articulate the principles on which the organisation is founded. Francis may see himself as the servant of servants (which he clearly is and I applaud him for this) but he has a responsibility to lead the Church as its visible head by giving clear and unambiguous guidance to the sheep in his fold. He is the shepherd of the flock of Christ who are scattered and prey to the wolves. More than any other time in history we need clear and unambiguous solid teaching from the Peter, the rock. View attachment 4901
It is not a question of who and to what degree the Holy Spirit may be guiding a particular individual. The thing we KNOW is that the Holy Spirit IS guiding the Church.
Well, somebody is getting their wires crossed. We know that we are hearing the voice of the Holy Spirit when the Church speaks as one. Right now, that isn't happening. The CDF and 2000 years of Church history are saying one thing, Cardinals very close to the Pope are saying another, and the Pope is keeping shtum. Something's amiss here and it's the Pope's duty to sort it out.
I can only speak for myself. I need no clarification nor reassurance from my Pope. He is no Pilate but I believe he is justified in Pilates words "What I have written, I have written." Pope Francis, far from washing his hands he has immersed himself totally in the mission of Mercy entrusted to Him in accordance with Tradition and Scripture " Lord not only my feet but my hands and my Head." If ever a Pope has given his feet, hands and head to the world in the name of Jesus this is he. Perhaps he will pander to the doubters and disbelievers by some statement of clarification but in my mind and in my eyes there is neither obligation not necessity for this.
