I'm avoiding talking about the AL but with many others I am watching and listening to the 'holy ' leaders in the church. We live in very sad and confusing times but I continue to pray for Pope Francis and the church. Ultimately God and His truth wins. So sad to have come to this place when many will be led astray.
'Stuttgart, Germany, Apr 29, 2016 / 10:49 am (CNA).- Greatly valued as an advisor by Saint John Paul II, a friend of Benedict XVI, and widely held to be the most important German Catholic philosopher of recent decades, Robert Spaemann, emeritus professor of philosophy at the University of Munich, expressed a distinctly critical interpretation of Amoris laetitia in this interview with Anian Christoph Wimmer, editor of CNA's German-language edition. Please find below the full text of the interview.' http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/n...ith-robert-spaemann-on-amoris-laetitia-10088/ What consequences do you see for the Church? The consequences are already foreseeable: uncertainty and confusion, from the bishops' conferences to the small parishes in the middle of nowhere. A few days ago, a priest from the Congo expressed to me his perplexity in light of this new papal document and the lack of clear precedents. According to the respective passages from Amoris laetitia, not only remarried divorcés but also everyone living in some certain “irregular situation” could, by further nondescript “mitigating circumstances”, be allowed to confess other sins and receive Communion even without trying to abandon their sexual conduct - that means without confession and conversion. Each priest who adheres to the until-now valid discipline of the sacraments, could be mobbed by the faithful and be put under pressure from his bishop. Rome can now make the stipulation that only “merciful” bishops will be named, who are ready to soften the existing discipline. Chaos was raised to a principle by the stroke of a pen. The Pope must have known that he would split the Church with such a step and lead toward a schism – a schism that would not be settled on the peripheries, but rather in the heart of the Church. May God forbid that from happening. One thing, however, seems clear to me: the concern of this Pope – that the Church should overcome her own self-referencing in order to be able to free-heartedly approach persons – has been destroyed by this papal document for an unforeseeable amount of time. A secularizing push and the further decrease in the number of priests in many parts of the world are also to be expected. It has been able to be observed for quite some time that bishops and diocese with a clear stance on faith and morality have the greatest increase in priests. We must remember the words of St. Paul in the Letter to the Corinthians: “If the bugle gives an indistinct sound, who will get ready for battle?” (1 Cor. 14:8). In your opinion, where do we go from here? Every single cardinal, but also every bishop and priest, is called upon to preserve uprightly the Catholic discipline of the sacraments within his realm of responsibility and to confess it publicly. In case the Pope is not ready to make corrections, it remains reserved for a later Pope to officially make things right.
Robert Spaemann's comments were published yesterday. Yesterday's column by David Warren in his excellent Essays in Idleness 'anti-blog', as he describes it, reminds us that, appropriately enough, it was also the feast day of Saint Catherine of Sienna. May she pray for us at this time in which we so urgently need truth to be spoken to power.
It gets to me that a prominent layperson like Robert called time on this total mess. It should have been one or more of the Cardinals. Perhaps one or two of them will grow a little backbone now. I certainly hope so. It would be about time for heads to pop out of the rabbit holes..
Pope Paul VI upheld all the traditions and Dogmas. He was ignored, everyone went their own way. Saint JP II upheld all the traditions and Dogmas. He was ignored, everyone went their own way. Pope Benedict upheld all the traditions and Dogmas. He was ignored, everyone went their own way. We arrived at chaos under the leadership of the last three excellent Popes, through disobedience. Now Pope Francis is at the helm of a ship in mutiny, and he inherited a mess because no one bothered to obey the Holy Fathers since God knows when. We have been behaving like a bunch of heretics for the last 50 years. Saint Padre Pio would say; pray, hope, and don't worry. He would never criticize the Pope like heretics do. God is capable of removing the Pope at any instant if He so Wills. Francis is Pope because God wills it. Amen. God needs servants not masters. We are called to be servants not masters.
http://www.ligonier.org/learn/devotionals/distinguishing-active-and-passive-wills-god/ Distinguishing the Active and Passive Wills of God Joseph said about the treachery perpetrated by his brothers, “You meant it for evil; God meant it for good” (Gen. 50:20). God’s good will was served through the bad will of Joseph’s brothers. This does not mean that since they were only doing the will of God the acts of the brothers were actually virtuous. All acts must be judged together with their intentions, and the actions of Joseph’s brothers were rightly judged by God to be evil. That God brings good out of evil only underscores the power and the excellence of His sovereign, decretive will. We sometimes get at this same problem by distinguishing between God’s active will and His passive will. Again we face difficulties. When God is “passive,” He is, in a sense, actively passive. I do not mean to speak nonsense but merely to show that God is never totally passive. When He seems to be passive, He is actively choosing not to intercede directly. Augustine addressed the problem this way: “Man sometimes with a good will wishes something which God does not will, as when a good son wishes his father to live, while God wishes him to die. Again it may happen that man with a bad will wishes what God wills righteously, as when a bad son wishes his father to die, and God also wills it …For the things which God rightly wills, He accomplishes by the evil wills of bad men.” Coram Deo Can you remember when God used what was intended for evil to accomplish good in your life? Give Him thanks for those times. Pope Alexander VI Of Alexander's many mistresses the one for whom passion lasted longest was Vannozza (Giovanna) dei Cattanei, born in 1442, and wife of three successive husbands. The connection began in 1470, and she had four children whom he openly acknowledged as his own: Cesare (born 1475), Giovanni, afterwards duke of Gandia (born 1476), Lucrezia (born 1480), and Goffredo or Giuffre (born 1481 or 1482). For a period of time, before legitimizing his children after becoming Pope, Rodrigo pretended that his four children with Vannozza were his niece and nephews and that they were fathered by Vannozza's husbands.[citation needed] Before his elevation to the papacy, Cardinal Borgia's passion for Vannozza somewhat diminished, and she subsequently led a very retired life. Her place in his affections was filled, according to some, by the beautiful Giulia Farnese ("Giulia la Bella"), wife of an Orsini. However, he still very dearly loved Vanozza, in a way he considered 'spiritual', and his love for his children by Vannozza remained as strong as ever and proved, indeed, the determining factor of his whole career. He lavished vast sums on them and lauded them with every honor. Vanozza lived in the Palace of a late Cardinal, or in a large, palatial villa. The children lived between their mother's home and the Papal Palace itself. The atmosphere of Alexander's household is typified by the fact that his daughter Lucrezia apparently lived with Giulia at a point.[14]
Can there be evil Popes? Of course there can for the Church has known several . Can there be bad popes? Of course there can, for the Church has known very many. Can there be weak or indifferent Popes? Of course there can, for once again the Church has known these men. Was this the Will of God? Yes, the Passive Will of God rather than the Active, for He, in His Wisdom,acceded to the perverse will of the Cardinals who elected them. God gave us all free will to choose for good or ill, even in the Election of Popes. If He had not all our Popes, without exception, would have been Great men and Great Saints. To think otherwise is to delude ourselves, despite the lessons our history teaches. Isaiah 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.
Our Church is meant to be salt of the Earth, to stand apart from the evils that plague our world and not to acceed to or accomodate them. The Societies that do so are about to fall, as Israel did of old. If the Church acedes to these evils, as it appears on the point of so doing, it too ,will fall. The Salt will loose its savour, as Jesus warned. and those who stand for the Truth called Pharisees, self righteous and judgemental. ..and spat upon and rejected by the very people charged by God to serve the Truth most. To take the sinful standards of the World as our own in the , 'Progess', 'Mercy' and 'Enlightenment'.
Our Lady said at Fatima, 'In Portugal the Dogma of the Faith will be preserved'. By implication the Dogma will be lost in many places elsewhere. We need to start to ask ourselves if this is starting to happen before our very eyes. Our Lady of Fatima said this in 1917 , we approach the centenary, this can be no accident. View attachment 4839
The greatest crime of the German people was that they were both obedient and silent in the face of a great evil
Short of causing a schism, Padraig, there's little they can do but hang in there and do their best to make sure the the next Pope is one who will undo any damage. We saw the mercy meted out to Cardinal Burke. The inner circle in the Vatican are well aware that orthodox bishops will avoid schism at all costs. The writing was on the wall with: "we don't need to focus on abortion all the time"; "who am I to judge"; the gay couple getting an invite to the Vatican; the abortionist being called a forgotten great; the Lutherans being given Communion in the Vatican; the all religions are equal message from the video, and the response to the question about the Zika virus and birth control. Most significant of all was when, out of all the correspondence arriving at the Vatican each day, this lady's letter made it to the top of the pile and merited a 'phone call from the Pope: http://www.ncregister.com/blog/jimm...ed-and-civilly-remarried-woman-she-could-rece . For all the flowery language in the Exhortation, by the Pope's example it only takes a phone call to solve the problem of Communion for people in "irregular" situations. Anyone raising concerns will be labelled an unmerciful pharisee, sadducee or some sort of heretic. After all, didn't Jesus eat with sinners?
The reality is that there is very little respect for the sacredness of the Eucharist. Many people who turn up at church at weddings or funerals go to communion irrespective of of how they conduct their lives. They don't see confession as a requirement. The church does not preach. I know priests who ,at weddings, have pointed out the requirements for receiving communion and they have been reported to their bishop. This exhortation is making official what's happening anyway. I think the orthodox cardinals must speak out and request that the Eucharist be defended.
We must of course alway be obedient to the Holy Fath as is written: Matthew 18:18 "Truly I tell you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven. However and it is a big however. How the teachings of the Holy Father are inerpreted by individuals such as Cardinals and Bishops who have fallen into heresy , it is entirely another matter. If we were, say a preist of EUcharistic Minsiter in Berlin and were told by the Cardinal to adminster a communion which we knew to be sacriligeous we have the duty to refuse and refuse absloutley. If we do adminster such a communion in the false name of obedience we wil lanswer for it before the Throne of the Most High God. The Church has always taught in such matters the primacy of conscience. https://www.ewtn.com/library/DOCTRINE/CONSC.TXT Pope Francis has not said we should give sacriligeous communions, but has, I belive opened the door to others to do so (whether or not he fully realises this). I believe we have entered the times indicated by prophesy of a weak Pope. w.google.co.uk/search?q=weak+pope+catholic+prohesy&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&channel=fs&gws_rd=cr,ssl&ei=gZwlV-nsCIWVUbvjsaAG#q=weak+pope+catholic+prophecy Blessed Catherine Emmerich has indicated that there would be two, 'weak Popes' . Blessed Anne Catherine Emmerich: “I saw also the relationship between the two popes. . . I saw how baleful (harmful) would be the consequences of this false church. I saw it increase in size; heretics of every kind came into the city (of Rome). The local clergy grew lukewarm, and I saw a great darkness…” However , having said this Francis is legitamete Pope, weak or not and must be obeyed. We must simply wait for a subsequent Pope to undo the grave damge he is currently doing. This time was also forcast at Fatima and Akita in Japan. 'Each day, recite the prayers of the Rosary. With the Rosary, pray for the Pope, the bishops and the priests. The work of the devil will infiltrate even into the Church in such a way that one will see cardinals opposing cardinals, and bishops against other bishops. The priests who venerate me will be scorned and opposed by their Confreres. The Church and altars will be vandalized. The Church will be full of those who accept compromises and the demon will press many priests and consecrated souls to leave the service of the Lord. "The demon will rage especially against souls consecrated to God. The thought of the loss of so many souls is the cause of my sadness. If sins increase in number and gravity, there will no longer be pardon for them."' http://olrl.org/prophecy/akita.shtml As Sister Lucia of Fatima said in an interview with Frere Michael Fuentes: "The devil knows what it is that most offends God and which in a short space of time will gain for him the greatest number of souls." "Thus the devil does everything to overcome souls consecrated to God because in this way, the devil will succeed in leaving the souls of the faithful abandoned by their leaders, thereby the more easily will he seize them." But as is written in scripture. 2 Corinthians 11:14 Paul and the False Apostles …13For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. 14No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. 15Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds. View attachment 4840
Nevertheless Pope Francis, weak or not is still our legitamate Pope and must be obeyed. We must wait until God sends us a Pope who is strong to resolve and repair the grave harm that has been done. Till then we must pray for Our Holy Father, the Cardinals, Bishops and priests and wait for better times. But we have a real obligation to speak out against and disobey heretics who have infiltrated Holy Mother Church and attempt to force us to do what is evil. There is nothing new in all this it has all hapeened before, with Arianism, for instance...and the Donatists: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arianism
I believe St. Catherine will have lived a life of 'personal' sacrifice and prayer. I do not believe she went around the public square telling every one what she thought of the Pope. She is recorded as contacting the Pope personally and making her concerns known to him, not talking behind his back. And this is what scares me. Are we living saintly lives. If we get a chance to speak to the Pope, then I am sure God will understand if we put our concerns to him personally. I remember this type of behaviour towards Pope Paul VI, and I never listened to it without standing up for him. Same with Pope Francis. He needs our love and our prayers. And we will be held to account for our Judgemental behaviour. Let's be the salt of the earth Jesus asked us to be. Like the great saints before us; 'personal' sacrifice and prayer. While we wait for the Warning.
Padraig, who is forcing you to live in sin and then receive Holy Communion. No one I am abstaining from meat on a Friday just like we did 60 years ago. I am in a lifelong marriage the same as my parents before me. I try to keep the 10 Commandments like my forefathers before me. No one is making me sin. No one is making you sin. So what is the issue. I believe we are foot soldiers, not princes or judges. And foot soldiers are just asked to do their job.
Of course I agree with you about sacrifice and prayer, but as for avoiding even respectful debate: "Melchior Cano, the great Dominican theologian from the Council of Trent, said: "Those who blindly and indiscriminately defend every decision of the supreme Pontiff are the very ones who do most to undermine the authority of the Holy See—they destroy instead of strengthening its foundations."" After all, if we just accept all the words and deeds of the pope in office, will we even be impelled to pray about any of these? How are we to know if anything requires prayer if we are not even to discuss it? Nor is this forum necessarily a 'public square'. It is not unreasonable to assert that it is rather a place containing a considerably higher concentration of orthodoxy and sense of responsibility than is to be found in the former; or I am greatly mistaken.
