Latin Mass, Catholic Church Tradition brings Vocations Boom(!) to Order of Carmelite Nuns.

WOW is all I can say.
POINT

 

That image should be like a watermark in every church behind the altar, especially those which have been remodeled to look Protestant. My former one is a great case in point.

 

Of course the form in which a priest offers the Mass is of the utmost importance! It took many years to perfect. Even unholy priests can offer a valid Mass as long as the Rubics are followed. Many of the problems we are now facing with the liturgy is because of the innovations that took place after Bugnini was allowed to make changes to it.

http://catholicapologetics.info/modernproblems/newmass/bugnini.html

 

We know from many exorcists that the use of Latin is more efficacious. Of course if that's the case with exorcists, why wouldn't it be more efficacious to have the Mass said in Latin?

According to exorcist Bishop Andrea Gemma of Isernia - "The devil is happy with the near-disappearance of Latin," said the bishop.

To say that the NO has had no role in the falling away from faith seems to be mere conjecture and illogical. Where do we find the resurgence of faith today- especially in young people? Latin. TLM. Tradition. Is that a coincidence too? Unlikely.

Sg posted this last page but it bears repeating:

Lex Orandi, Lex Credendi, Lex Vivendi


Note: I usually go to NO masses -although my parish has incorporated a lot of Latin, and we seem to be attending the TLM a lot more as our understanding grows - so I'm not saying that the NO mass isn't valid. Just want to ensure my meaning isn't misunderstood here. I also do not know of anyone here on MOG that maintains that the NO is invalid.

 

This is an old debate between E Michael Jones & Michael Davies about the SSPX and schism -- it is long in 4 parts but I enjoyed watching and listening to it --

It was refreshing to see a good old fashioned debate carried out in the spirit of charity --

It also made me think, which is a good thing!!

So if you have a couple of hours to spare have a watch


Part One


Part Two


Part Three


Part Four

 

Here's an article from Fr. Donald Kloster at Liturgy Guy, posted on another thread earlier: "Pope Benedict XVI, Summorum Pontificum, 2007: "the Church’s rule of prayer (lex orandi) corresponds to her rule of faith (lex credendi).” [1]

Eminent among the Popes who showed such proper concern was Saint Gregory the Great, who sought to hand on to the new peoples of Europe both the Catholic Faith and the treasures of worship and culture amassed by the Romans in preceding centuries. He ordered that the form of the Sacred Liturgy, both of the Sacrifice of the Mass and the Divine Office, as celebrated in Rome, should be defined and preserved. He greatly encouraged those monks and nuns who, following the Rule of Saint Benedict, everywhere proclaimed the Gospel and illustrated by their lives the salutary provision of the Rule that “nothing is to be preferred to the work of God.” In this way the Sacred Liturgy, celebrated according to the Roman usage, enriched the faith and piety, as well as the culture, of numerous peoples. It is well known that in every century of the Christian era the Church’s Latin Liturgy in its various forms has inspired Countless Saints in their spiritual life, confirmed many peoples in the virtue of religion and enriched their devotion ...

In the course of the centuries, many other Roman Pontiffs took particular care that the sacred liturgy should accomplish this task more effectively. Outstanding among them was Saint Pius V, who in response to the desire expressed by the Council of Trent, renewed with great pastoral zeal the Church’s entire worship, saw to the publication of liturgical books corrected and “restored in accordance with the norm of the Fathers,” and provided them for the use of the Latin Church."

Vocations Foundations
OCT 8

Posted by Brian Williams



The following guest post was written by frequent contributor Fr. Donald Kloster, parochial vicar at St. Mary’s in the Diocese of Bridgeport, Connecticut.

I’ve been mulling over many questions lately that pertain to the families of those who enter a Traditional Latin Mass (TLM) vocation to the Priesthood and/or Religious life. A related query is how well the Traditional Latin Mass retains those children now being brought up within the Traditional Latin Mass since their early childhood or at least from the time of their earliest memories.

My experience with those raised in the Latin Mass prior to the Second Vatican Council tells me that the knowledge and retention of the faith is promoted by the Vetus Ordo. My Novus Ordo observations tell me that it leaks faithful like a faulty gasket of an engine leaks oil.

The Novus Ordo culture has produced a plethora of faithful who know very little about their faith despite a myriad of “new” catechetical gimmicks. The Rite of the Mass cannot but help to nourish the soul in the degrees of fidelity to the Apostolic praxis. We are the result of the Mass we pray. In the Novus Ordo, the engine still runs, but it runs at a diminished capacity because of a minimalist design.

My priest friends who don’t say the TLM are almost single minded in their rebuttal of my conclusion. They insist that it’s all about the families in which people are raised. Wrong. On both sides of the argument, either one can point to families that were fairly exemplary but their children don’t practice the faith once they leave home. Or, as I’ve come across, many others whose parents did not practice the Faith regularly and now their children have chosen to do so as adults on their own.

I’ve lived in 11 different US Dioceses and lived on three continents. Perhaps that speaks less in my favor as it pertains to my being bounced around as I was! Anecdotes can only be dismissed if the sample size of the given observation is small and fairly isolated. My sample size is quite large. Sometimes anecdotal occurrences are repeated so often that the conclusion should not be dismissed; that is as it pertains to reasonable thinking.

I’ve been involved in TLM circles for 28 years and have said the Traditional Mass for 20 years. I am, however, a product of the Novus Ordo. I never even saw a TLM until I was 24 years old. I went to the Seminary and was ordained as a Novus Ordo priest. My first TLM was as a 3 year ordained priest in 1998. I have no dog in this fight. Really, when I began to say the TLM I thought it was just for the good of my priestly spirituality. I never thought the TLM would catch on again in any wider scope; ever.

This past year, I have been doing a National Study on the TLM only parishes in the USA. Currently, there are around 70 of these but they are exploding in numbers with each passing year because the TLM priestly vocations are outpacing Novus Ordo priestly vocations by more than 7 to 1. My preliminary numbers are exceeding my initial expectations.

There is a huge wave transforming the Catholic landscape and it is largely being ignored by the Catholic leadership. I can now say what I suspected last year. The Novus Ordo is dying and it will be replaced by the Vetus Ordo sooner than anyone had foreseen, but certainly by 2050 the TLM will be the dominant liturgical practice once again.

My instincts tell me that 30-50% of the current vocations coming from the Traditional Latin Mass were not raised in it. Next year, I’ll try to test that feeling with the aforementioned study. A great number of the young men and women entering the TLM orders discovered it themselves; it wasn’t their family upbringing. My belief is that the Ancient Mass is the vocations catalyst and not the family per se.

One can certainly find a vocation as a Novus Ordo attendee, but all of the evidence suggests that many, many more are found as a TLM attendee. One huge proof is the precipitous vocations drop off after the Council and the abandoning of the 1962 Missal. The other proof is that vocations continue to rocket up in 2018 in the TLM and have leveled off at a very much lower level in the Novus Ordo seminaries and convents using the 1970 Missal. The Novus Ordo closed convents and seminaries will never reach their previous levels because there is no upward trend; not even in the same ballpark. Remember, all Catholics live in the same society and we all have similar temptations and spiritual obstacles to overcome. “By their fruit ye shall know them” (Mt. 7:16).

Finally, let’s be clear. This article is not intended to disparage anyone. Not one of us should cling to anything that is passing away. There is no reason to put your faith in something in order to win an argument or simply because at one time you thought things would improve with the Novus Ordo. Instead, things got much worse.

At the dawn of the promulgation of the Novus Ordo, we bled a big majority of Mass attending Catholics. No one asked them what they preferred. No one gave them any options. If they had been asked and/or allowed to attend the Mass of the Ages, the Novus Ordo would not have supplanted the formative Mass of every canonized saint to date. Now bishops often repeat the stale quoted refrain, “almost no one wants the TLM.” Why do they suddenly care what the proverbial “people” want? They didn’t care back in 1970 when almost none of the faithful wanted a vernacular Mass. It’s true the Church is not a democracy. She is a theocracy and God will have His way! Everything is coming back full circle and I have a lot of buried relatives and friends who, if living today, would be overjoyed.

Pope Benedict XVI: "What was sacred for prior generations, remains sacred and great for us as well, and cannot be suddenly prohibited altogether or even judged harmful.”[2] From:http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/p...doc_20110430_istr-universae-ecclesiae_en.html Much wider use and more frequent offering - in accordance with the wishes of the Holy Father - of the Tridentine Mass, the Mass of the Council of Trent and of Pope St. Pius V, and of Gregorian Chant, the beautiful liturgical musical creation of the Catholic under Pope St. Gregory the Great and the Popes, which non-Catholics have called the Music of the Angels, and which the Second Vatican Council commanded to be given pride of place, [Sacrosanctum Concilium, p. 116 "116. The Church acknowledges Gregorian Chant as specially suited to the Roman liturgy: therefore, other things being equal, it should be given pride of place in liturgical services.", Second Vatican Council] is key to obtaining the graces needed for the Triumph of Christ's Kingdom of Divine Will and the Immaculate Heart of Mary to come quickly. Holy Mass is our principal source of grace. The Tradition of all ages and even Vatican II prefers Holy Mass to be offered in theTraditional Roman Way, because that obtains the greatest graces for the Church. That meansVersus Deum should be preferred to Versus Populum wherevere possible, because Holy Mass is about giving Glory to God and not to man. At least during Offertory and leading up to the Canon or Eucharistic Prayers, the most important part of Holy Mass, where we participate in the Eternal Sacrifice.

 

In the Tridentine Mass, which the Holy Father calls the Extraordinary Form, which imho has extraordinary effects of grace, there are beautiful Offertory Prayers like these, which every Catholic heart would delight in praying: Bugnini et all, the Freemasonic infiltrators, did not like them, and strove to be minimalist with them.

"P: Receive, O Holy Father, Almighty and Eternal God, this Spotless Host, which I, Thine unworthy servant, offer unto Thee, my living and true God, for my countless sins, trespasses, and omissions; likewise for all here present, and for all faithful Christians, whether living or dead, that it may avail both me and them to salvation, unto life everlasting. Amen.

[The Priest goes to the Epistle side and pours wine and water into the chalice.]

P: O God, Who in creating man didst exalt his nature very wonderfully and yet more wonderfully didst establish it anew: by the mystery signified in the mingling of this water and wine, grant us to have part in the Godhead of Him Who hath vouchsafed to share our manhood, Jesus Christ, Thy Son, Our Lord, Who liveth and reigneth with Thee in the Unity of the Holy Ghost, God; world without end. Amen.

P: We Offer unto Thee, O Lord, the Chalice of Salvation, beseeching Thy clemency that it may ascend as a sweet odor before Thy Divine Majesty, for our own salvation, and for that of the whole world. Amen.

P: Humbled in mind, and contrite of heart, may we find favour with Thee, O Lord; and may the Sacrifice we this day offer up be well pleasing to Thee, Who art our Lord and our God.

P: Come, Thou, the Sanctifier, God, Almighty and Everlasting: bless (✠) this Sacrifice which is prepared for the Glory of Thy holy name."

https://lms.org.uk/missals

And so, the Traditional Roman Offertory too, and the Ancient Roman Canon, which is now called, Eucharistic Prayer I, could be used as often as possible. At any rate, wherever the Tridentine Mass, kneeling for Holy Communion, Altar Rails, Genuflection before the Blessed Sacrament reserved in the Tabernacle, and other genuinely Catholic orthopraxis is restored, it almost inevitably follows, just as the Lex Orandi, Lex Credendi rule says, that also doctrinal orthodoxy is preserved.

"Through more than twenty years of offering both the Novus Ordo Mass (NOM) and the Traditional Latin Mass (TLM), this writer has observed variations between the people attending the two different Masses within the Roman Rite. American Catholics attending the NOM have been surveyed repeatedly in terms of their beliefs and practices (Pew Research and Center for Applied Research in the Apostolate at Georgetown University [CARA]).

Yet, the body of research does not appear to include a description of Catholics who attend the TLM. These Catholics attend at least 489 Sunday Masses nationwide (latinmassdir.org, 2019). On any given Sunday, an estimated 100,000 Catholics (slightly over 200 faithful per Mass and/or parish) in the United States of America worship according to the ancient Mass that, prior to the Second Vatican Council (1962-1965), was offered in Latin for over 1,500 years.

The quickly growing number of TLM-only parishes permits survey research going beyond one individual’s observations. The objective of this pilot study was to measure the fruit of the two Masses, by directly comparing the TLM and NOM attendees’ responses to the same questions."

https://liturgyguy.com/2019/02/24/n...s-what-we-learned-about-latin-mass-attendees/

"Results



What do these fruits tell us? If we make every effort to restore solidly Catholic praxis more widely, then we will see solidly Catholic belief return as well.

God bless.

 

Did you forget the part we mentioned in an earlier thread of this same topic: we get what we have deserved.

 

I'm not sure what to make of your comment.
Whatever the reason for the imposition of the NOM on us, it will be the TLM that brings abundant graces and fruits upon us.
May God's Will be done.

 

We might have to wait until after the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart for that. Yes, may God’s will be done always.