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Discussion in 'The mystical and Paranormal' started by Allyd, Mar 17, 2016.

  1. Andy3

    Andy3 Powers

    I don't think he is on the forum anymore or even check in. I emailed him last year a bit and he is so busy in his ministry he does not look much at the internet. He really is a good soul, time will tell if he is legit. I love all his talks about places of refuge and angels coming and literally taking up entire homes with families in them to move them to these places but as wonderful as it sounds also seems like could be a bit far fetched. Not because it is not possible for God and His Angels but more because we never hear of places of refuge in the bible unless I am missing something.
     
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  2. PurpleFlower

    PurpleFlower Powers

    The idea of refuges has always perplexed me. As Christians in love with Christ, we don't seek to hide and escape from suffering. Where is the witness in that? We follow Christ to the Cross.
     
  3. Bumping my earlier comment, also the futurist map stuff is worth taking a look at if you're discerning this.


     
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  4. Marygar

    Marygar Byron

    Remember the catacombs.
     
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  5. padraig

    padraig Powers

    Refuges are very much a feature of Scripture and the Early Church.

    So much so that they are recurrent in our history that they are almost a theme.

    This first that springs to mind is the Flight of the Holy Family into Egypt. Why did they flee to Egypt? Because if they stayed were they were they would all have been killed.

    The Second is the Fall of Jerusalem to Rome. This caused a great Diaspora of the Early Church throughout the World. The Christians fled because Jesus warned of what would happen.

    In the Early Church in Rome Christians fled to the hiding places of the Catacombs.

    After the Early Roman Persecutions Catholic fled to the Monasteries to the Desert.

    After the Fall of the Roman Empire and the Dark Ages these Monasteries were the refuges that saved the Church.

    The Prophets in the Old Testament were forever running away to hiding in safe places.

    The Greatest Marian story of Refuge in Scripture is this one:


    Revelation 12

    New International Version

    The Woman and the Dragon
    12 A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and a crown of twelve stars on her head. 2 She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth. 3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on its heads. 4 Its tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to give birth, so that it might devour her child the moment he was born. 5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.”[a] And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne. 6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.

    7 Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8 But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9 The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

    10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say:

    “Now have come the salvation and the power
    and the kingdom of our God,
    and the authority of his Messiah.
    For the accuser of our brothers and sisters,
    who accuses them before our God day and night,
    has been hurled down.
    11 They triumphed over him
    by the blood of the Lamb
    and by the word of their testimony;
    they did not love their lives so much
    as to shrink from death.
    12 Therefore rejoice, you heavens
    and you who dwell in them!
    But woe to the earth and the sea,
    because the devil has gone down to you!
    He is filled with fury,
    because he knows that his time is short.”

    13 When the dragon saw that he had been hurled to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the male child. 14 The woman was given the two wings of a great eagle, so that she might fly to the place prepared for her in the wilderness, where she would be taken care of for a time, times and half a time, out of the serpent’s reach. 15 Then from his mouth the serpent spewed water like a river, to overtake the woman and sweep her away with the torrent. 16 But the earth helped the woman by opening its mouth and swallowing the river that the dragon had spewed out of his mouth. 17 Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to wage war against the rest of her offspring—those who keep God’s commands and hold fast their testimony about Jesus.
     
  6. padraig

    padraig Powers

    Note that the woman who flees from the dragon is a type Our Holy Mother the Church who has been forever fleeing to refuges from the dragon.

     
    Last edited: May 6, 2026
  7. padraig

    padraig Powers

  8. padraig

    padraig Powers

    I think the natural normal state of a Catholic is to be persecuted. If they are not being hit then to wonder maybe if they are doing something wrong?

    For instance a Catholic who works anywhere in the West for a Government and expressed clear Catholic views would be in big, big trouble. For instance if you publically said Sodomy was wrong. You'd be dead in the water.
     
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  9. PurpleFlower

    PurpleFlower Powers

    That's a good point.
     
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  10. Mario

    Mario Powers

    This report makes my blood boil for it shows a level of capitulation by the Vatican to allow freedom for the Government recognized bishops and churches (read compromised), but throws the underground Church to the dogs. I grieve and don't understand! How can this be?:cry::mad:
     
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  11. padraig

    padraig Powers

    Who set it up? Uncle Ted.

    Pope Leo is still going ahead with McCarrick's work.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. "Quis ut Deus"

    "Quis ut Deus" ADMIN Staff Member

    “Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves”
     
  13. padraig

    padraig Powers

     
  14. Thanks padraig.I will watch later. I forget about that history.
     
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  15. "Quis ut Deus"

    "Quis ut Deus" ADMIN Staff Member


    My own special moment in St Agatha's catacombs in Rabat Malta this is the picture of the altar that I touched and prayed at for everyone on the forum.
    St Paul celebrated mass at this tiny altar.

    malta.jpg
     
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  16. How beautiful! Thank you!
     
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  17. PurpleFlower

    PurpleFlower Powers

    Weren't the catacombs more for burial of the Christian dead and for holding Masses in their honor...and for having secret meetings sometimes? People didn't live there in hiding, did they?

    I've been in the catacombs, and those passageways are narrow, with walls of tombs on either side.

    I don't know a whole lot about the modern idea of refuges, other than ideas that angels will transport people to safe places during persecution and tribulation. I haven't heard of such a thing in any approved apparition. What I do hear is that the good will have much to suffer, along with the bad.

    I feel like the idea of refuges sounds wonderful and safe, as if we've merited comfort by our supposedly upright lives, while the rest of the non-remnant has to be punished. It seems quite similar to the non-Catholic idea of the rapture.

    I'm more inclined to believe that we are all at fault for how sinful the world has become, and our job is to beg God's mercy upon all of us. After all, the faithful remnant is supposed to be enough to save the rest of the world with their prayers and sacrifices. We're the ones Mary comes to warn, because if we would listen to her, we could bring down enough graces on the rest of the world to avert chastisement.
     
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  18. miker

    miker Powers


    I really appreciate your perspective and I find myself in the same place. I don’t doubt that God could create physical refuges if He chose to. He has protected His people in many different ways throughout history. But when I read the Bible and stories of saints, and also approved apparitions, the refuge God consistently prepares for us is ultimately Heaven! I think while we walk this Earth, the refuge He offers us is His own Heart.

    For me, the real “safe place” isn’t a particular place but the peace that comes from being in communion and love with Christ. By my trusting Him and staying close to Him, He will be my shelter and place of refuge no matter what is happening in the world. That kind of refuge doesn’t depend on my circumstances. He can be my refuge after a horrific car crash, a terrible diagnosis, or a world war. It’s available to me and every soul who turns to Him.

    So I understand why the idea of physical refuges appeals to people and believe God can do this if He chooses. But I think the deeper refuge God desires for me is within my own heart with faith, trust, repentance, and union with Him. That’s where I try to find my rest, and that’s where I believe He wants to hold me and my family through whatever trials come.
     
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  19. Marygar

    Marygar Byron

    Historical facts are being changed. In past teachings, it was not a myth to believe catacombs were a safe place for Christian’s to escape to from persecution. But today it’s not politically correct to teach against the Roman’s.
     
  20. padraig

    padraig Powers

    I was honestly surprised to read that the Catacombs were being down played nowadays. I knew that modern secular historians had been down playing the scale of the early persecutions but I did not do they had moved on to the Catacombs. It seems to me we should be very,very careful of these, 'Experts', having there very own anti Catholic agendas. I believe the evidence that they were indeed used as refuges is overwhelming.

    https://www.historyanswers.co.uk/an...ls-and-christians-made-a-home-in-the-shadows/

    All this reminds me of the, ' Experts' who did the carbon dating on the Turin Shroud. There is clear evidence now of a conspiracy to debunk the Shroud.
     

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