You do not seem to understand that they are two tribulations. This is the view which has been held unanimously since the fourth century. I’ve provided all the books. The great apostasy has not happened, it will happen before the Antichrist is revealed. But that isn’t for our time. The series of events I have shared makes this so clear. No my timeline (one which is shared by many) says peace - return to sin - the great apostasy - Antichrist. Did you not read my posts? St. Paul, Aquinas and the Church Fathers are clearly describing the second part of the tribulation. So because Holhauzer and all the other saints, blesseds, and venerables mentioned in books like Catholic Prophecy by Yves DuPont disagree with you they’ve been “mistranslated”. That’s very convenient for your new way of interpreting prophecy. If you have to shoehorn everything into “symbolism” or “mistranslation” to suit your narrative, it’s probably not the truth. Exactly!
the "end of the world" for everyone is when his\her worlds ends ie; personal death, right? lately Im personal having a premonition my own life won't be long I fear a detorotation in my medical condition, I think sometimes studying possible large-term prophecies takes away the memento mori
You keep shifting around and not dealing directly with the problems that I have explained to you. 1. Our exchange started after you claimed to be able to prove that "the Antichrist was not in the world today." You said it could be proven "objectively." The "proofs" you provided are commentaries from Holzhauser and a book by Dupont and a YouTube video from some guy who thinks that the end times are all about geo-political events and predicting the future on earth. Your proofs are weak because your premises are built with weak authorities: Holzhauser, Dupont and the Youtube guy. You seem to think what they say carries real authority. You are mistaken. Things like the Magisterium, the Catechism, interpretations of Scripture by the Church Fathers are, generally, trustworthy and in the best cases infallible. In your syllogisms, you need to begin with concepts and statements found in those trustworthy sources, rather than just repeating third-hand interpretations of private revelations that you have not verified in the original languages. 2. Again, your opening comment was about "the Antichrist not being in the world today." St. Paul tells us the exact things to look for. Specifically, he says to look for the "man of sin/lawlessness" who will sit in "the temple of God" acting as if he is God. This description refers to an antipope. That is the infallible sign of the Antichrist, according to the Church. The Church does not use your faulty criteria. Stay close to the authentic Magisterium so that you are not deceived. 3. Since you have decided to deflect the conversation from the real problems in your original comment (noted above in #1 and #2), I will address your new topic, the "two tribulations." There are many ways to interpret these tribulations. For example, I do believe that there was a minor tribulation in the 1970s, after the Novus Ordo was introduced. It was during this time that the SSPX started, for example. The impetus for Lefebvre's crusade was "the minor tribulation" that he explains in his many books. There was then later a "liturgical peace" of sorts with JPII and BXVI. Then a "return to sin" with Bergoglio and the "the great apostasy"of synodality, which we are living through right now. What comes next on your list? Can you guess who has been the agent of the "great apostasy" and has deceived many Catholics? 4. As St. Paul says, immediately prior to Antichrist being "revealed" as such (to those who are already deceived by him), there is a revolt/apostasy from traditional Church teaching (2 Thess. 2) and there is also a false earthly "peace" (1 Thess. 5), engineered by the Antichrist and his allies. There is no long period in which "the whole world" believes the pure doctrine of the Roman Catholic Faith. That is a deception. It is a form of "millenarianism," if one takes it literally. This kind of "millenarianism" is specifically condemned in CCC 676 and it is identified with the "religious deception" of the Antichrist. So, your position, that a long period of peace and harmony on our current earth, for the whole of mankind, BEFORE the Antichrist comes is the position that Antichrist himself will promote. Again, the CCC says this, not me. You have these things exactly backwards. Again, you are cherry-picking a few private revelations, using unverified translations, and misinterpreting apocalyptic language in a literal way. The way out of this confusion for you is to stick to what the Magisterium says first and correct your misinterpretations of those private revelations using the standard of the Magisterium. Any private revelation, or interpretation of such, that is true must not contradict the Magisterium. Your interpretation contradicts St. Paul and the CCC.
1. I’ve proved that because all the quotes me and a host of others I have shown clearly demonstrate that the period of peace comes prior to the great apostasy and the Antichrist. THIS HASNT HAPPENED YET. My proofs as I have stated and have sent various links with them: dozens of Saints, approved mystics, theologians are on my side. Your ideas come from Sedevacantists and condemned apparitions. You are the one with the revolutionary annd schismatic idea: Pope Francis being the literal Antichrist. These books and translations have been accepted. If you have to say all of these things were translated incorrectly to fit your insane thesis, maybe your timeline is the unreliable one. Read the prophecies on the website you linked. They have a timeline with hundreds of quotations proving the timeline I have supported. 2. This hasn’t happened yet. I don’t see your argument. The Sedevacantists claim this happened with St. John Paul II. 3. Prophetically the tribulation didn’t happen in the 1970s because there was no murdered Pope, three fourths of the world getting murdered in a literal three days of darkness, and a period of Christendom under a holy pope and great monarch. This is honestly laughable. I can send you an excellent video from a prominent SSPX YouTuber debunking your claims. 4. There have been large failings away from the faith every few centuries since Jesus founded the Church. None of these were the great apostasy. You have yet to prove this is the great one. The prophecies that promote the triumph of the Immaculate Heart do not say that the world will be sinless or that all will convert. In fact the Jewish people definitely won’t convert yet. These are all on the timeline. Read them. This is not at all related to millenarianism and to suggest such a thing tells me you don’t know what the period of peace is. Then the world will turn back to sin then the great apostasy. There will not be peace directly before the Antichrist. The peace will long be over and in fact the world will be very wicked. This is made obvious by simply reading the prophecy of La Salette. My interpretation does not contradict the Catechism or St. Paul. These things will happen in the second part of the tribulation. I don’t “cherry pick” private revelations, I look at all of the verified ones and see what they tell us. The magisterium has yet to tell the world “the Antichrist is Pope Francis”. That’s the root of your argument. If you are wrong you are calling the Vicar of Christ the Antichrist. For that you are putting your immortal soul on the line. My interpretation is clear. It doesn’t have to shoehorn things into a preconceived notion. I let the prophecies speak for themselves. I did not create this timeline, rather its authors are the Saints. I don’t need to say everything is symbolic, or claim that my opponents have mistranslated texts, or that canonized Saints and words from Our Lady are wrong and that I alone have uncovered the truth about the end times that everyone else got wrong. I gave you a book. If you’re too lazy to read a book I gave you a YouTube video. If you’re too lazy to do that, I’ve offered a website you can read at your convenience. If you aren’t willing to do any of those things, it’s obvious to me you don’t care about the truth, you care about pushing an agenda.
Saint John tells us in the Book of Revelation that those things were about to happen soon, which was partially fulfilled with the rise of the infamous Emperor Nero Caesar, whose name, when translated into Greek gematria, resulted in the number 666. So, I believe the book is open, and some of its prophecies unfold throughout history. However, at the end of times, there will be the final one who precedes the Glorious Return of Christ. I hope no one gets upset with me for taking a middle ground in this discussion.
1. You haven't proven anything. You have simply made statements that suggest patterns and connections. There is nothing inherently wrong with doing that as long as you don't think you have proven anything by doing so. Do you know what a logical "proof" consists of? Do you understand what a categorical syllogism is? Clearly you don't. You think that "proof" consists of piling statement upon statement. You try to bury your interlocutor under heaps of (misinterpreted?) private revelations. Take a logic course to learn the steps required to prove something. Again, you are the one who claimed to be able to "objectively" prove that "the Antichrist is not in the world today." I do not claim to have logical proof of the opposite. I think there is evidence that the signs of the Antichrist, taught by the Magisterium, are in front of us today. You are free to disagree. In my opinion, you are deceived. We will see who is correct very soon. Very soon. 2. Do you really think that 3/4s of the world will be "murdered" during the Three Days of Darkness. Are you that simplistic? The prophecy is using apocalyptic exaggeration, which contains a wealth of spiritual truth. The souls of these people will be "murdered" figuratively because it will be revealed to them that they are in a state of mortal sin. Mortal sin. Get it? Mortal = life and death. Death of the soul because of choosing sin rather than the truth, as St. Paul says in 2 Thessalonians 2. That is what the Biblical prophecies are about. Not primarily about people physically dying. Remember what Jesus said in Matthew 10:28: "28 And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell." You are obsessed with the world, with the physical body, with political arrangements. Your preoccupations are earthy. You have too much focus on worldly matters, and it is blinding you to the real spiritual meaning of the prophecies. 3. I had read Yves Dupont's book years ago. It has interesting source material, but his interpretations are flawed, in my opinion. So Dupont is not an infallible authority for me. Holzhauser is not an infallible commentator, even though he is worth reading. The Buccanieri website suffers, unfortunately, from many of the same mistakes that you make. It would be much better if she would just present the source material with the original untranslated texts (side by side). The Youtube video with the timeline is spreading falsehoods, as if it can predict civil wars and geopolitical events in the future like some oracle. Maybe the guy who made it is sincere. But he is very confused. I will pray for him. So, see, I did look at all of the sources you pointed me to. You on the other hand seem to have not done the same, as far as I can tell. Instead of having a conversation about the specifics of the CCC or St. Paul or St. Thomas Aquinas, you constantly deflect back to your fallible (possibly erroneous) sources. If you will mediate on those Magisterial sources that I pointed you to, you should see that you are focusing on the wrong things, just like your Youtube friend is. Have a good day. I'm headed to Mass.
To me this argument comes down to two things: either the Saints are correct in their interpretation or you are. It’s really that simple. You haven’t proven why my interpretation has to be wrong. You just say anything that disagrees with you is symbolic. I’ve provided enough to prove for me and for many others what is obvious. You might have looked but you just ignored anything you didn’t like. I’ve read the entire Bible three times, the catechism once, and all the quotes you have sent from Aquinas. To me it’s obvious that they are referencing the second part of the tribulation. Have a good day. I hope you can escape from the schism you’ve put yourself in.
St Hildegard put things in a very understandable order. Along with ven Marie Julie Jahenny...too many to count. .. bl. Ann Emmerich.. the last 2 were very simple women and I think they were chosen for that reason. Definitely.
Filimariae, let's look at your favorite commentator, Ven. Holzhauser. Below is the quote from the website that you said you liked. https://greatmonarch-angelicpontiffprophecies.blogspot.com/p/blog-page_57.html Apparently, this is Ven. Holzhauser's interpretation of Chapter 10 of the Apocalypse featuring the great Angel who gives St. John a book to eat: “The 'angel' is the Great Monarch: 'from heaven' means he will be a catholic: 'clothed in clouds' implies he will be humble and modest; 'rainbow' he will bring peace to the world; 'sunshine' refers to his wisdom, talents and title; 'feet' refers to his power and zeal; 'Open book' he will rule with justice 'Right and left foot' he will exercise power over all the world; 'Lion Voice' he will put fear into the wicked. The 'Golden Crown' refers to his Holy Roman Empire; 'Cutlass' means his victorious army; the other 'angel' refers to the pope (Angelic pastor). 'Other angels' are the other helpers of the Great Monarch who will help him crush the Turks…” Ven. Holzhauser begins his analysis by identifying the "mighty angel" mentioned in Apocalypse 10 with what he calls "the Great Monarch." So, should I assume that you agree with Holzhauser on this point of his interpretation? This "Great Monarch," says Holzhauser, "will bring peace to the world." And he will "exercise power over all the world." He reigns over "his Holy Roman Empire." I ask you, Filimariae, are those descriptions to be taken literally. Will a "literal man" do those things in a literal way? Will he be the "Holy Roman Emperor," literally? Here is the text of the first part of Apocalypse, chapter 10: 1 And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, clothed with a cloud, and a rainbow was on his head, and his face was as the sun, and his feet as pillars of fire. 2 And he had in his hand a little book open: and he set his right foot upon the sea, and his left foot upon the earth. 3 And he cried with a loud voice as when a lion roareth. And when he had cried, seven thunders uttered their voices. 4 And when the seven thunders had uttered their voices, I was about to write: and I heard a voice from heaven saying to me: Seal up the things which the seven thunders have spoken; and write them not. 5 And the angel, whom I saw standing upon the sea and upon the earth, lifted up his hand to heaven, Look closely, Filimariae, this "mighty angel" comes down from "heaven," according to St. John. Holzhauser says that "heaven" means that he is "Catholic." Do you want to read that "symbolically," like Holzhauser does? Or do you want to read that literally? If you read the Apocalypse literally, then you are saying that a normal "man" will, literally, come down from "heaven." Please explain. Further, who do you guess that this man/mighty angel is? Is he the literal descendent of the Bourbon line of France, like MJJ says? How is it that he comes down from "heaven?" If he is a French monarch, how is it that he has power "over all the world." And what is this Holy Roman Empire, that Holzhauser refers to? Is France the same thing as the Holy Roman Empire, Filimariae? Here is a quote from the website that you like so much which discusses MJJ's prophecy of the Great Monarch: https://greatmonarch-angelicpontiffprophecies.blogspot.com/p/blog-page_62.html IDENTITY OF THE GREAT MONARCH - a King of France (*) The king France rejected it will one day accept (June 21, 1874) (*) The one 'Rejected and Abandoned' by the majority of men will be called by God and come forth - (Aug. 25 1882) (*) He will come out of exile (Dec. 31, 1874) (*) He is HENRY V - (March 25, 1974) + (Nov. 1874) + Henry ( June 1, 1877) + 'Henry of the Cross' (Feb 4, 1882) + Henry V of the Cross (Feb. 28, 1882) (*) He is the exiled 'MIRACLE CHILD' - ALL THE PROPHETIC WORDS refer to him. The Miracle Child of exile will "RETURN". (March 22, 1881) + He is the exiled one they call the 'Miracle Child' - MUCH LATER they will know the depths of his heart - he is "RESERVED FOR THE GREAT EPOCHS". (Sept. 6, 1890) (*) The exiled king WILL RETURN to claim the throne of France - men will say he will never return, and we are to ask them "ARE YOU PROPHETS?" (Sept. 29, 1878) + Also, "Let them say and affirm to men that he will never return. Listen to them and ask them if they are prophets!" (Sept. 6, 1890) (*) The king chosen by God will return to claim the throne, even though the whole universe seems poised against it and it seems impossible as it truly is impossible with man, only GOD can bring his return with His Divine Power. How this will be accomplished is veiled to the eyes of men and those blinded who never wished to acknowledge God's chosen king. (July 19, 1881) (*) The Great Monarch will not be of any other Bourbon pretender, nor a descendant of Napoleon Bonaparte or Louis Philippe, (Orleans House), nor will he descend from Naundorff. (March 28, 1874) (*) Has he been revealed? YES: the Great Monarch can be none other than - Henri Charles Ferdinand Marie Dieudonné d’Artois, Duke de Bordeaux, Count de Chambord- who was also called during his life HENRY V, the 'Child of Exile', and 'THE MIRACLE CHILD'. Click here for more detailed information on Henry V, the other prophecies by Marie-Julie Jahenny concerning him, including hints on how he will RETURN. So for MJJ, the "Great Monarch" is a man from France. Your friend E.J. Bucchianeri (who runs that website) is certain that he is "Henri Charles Ferdinand Marie Dieudonné d’Artois, Duke de Bordeaux, Count de Chambord." But St. John says he is a "mighty angel" and from "heaven," while Ven. Holzhauser says that "from heaven" means he's "Catholic" and that he will be the "Holy Roman Emperor." How can this be, Filimariae? Educate me on these apparent contradictions? The solution, of course, is that there are no contradictions, as long was one does not read these prophecies literally. Rather, one must use a hermeneutical method that teases out the essence of what is being conveyed by the very different prophetic narratives. That hermeneutic cannot be naively literal or naturalistic. The symbols used are not meant to be understood in that way. These prophecies are referring to supernatural realities, but they use symbols of every day life and people and institutions from history. The Bible prophecies are set up the same way. I can show you more things like this if you are interested. Let me guess, you're not interested? Well, my offer still stands.
Filimariae, before I forget, I want to show you where, in the end times timeline of the Apocalypse, Holzhauser's Great Monarch falls. And I can show you that the Great Monarch comes AFTER the Antichrist has already risen to power. Briefly, the section on the Seven Trumpets (Apoc. 8:6 -11:18), contains Three Woes. These Woes are sequential on a timeline. The rise of the Antichrist, called Apollyon by St. John, occurs during the First Woe (see Apocalypse 8:13-9:11). The rise of the Great Monarch, on the other hand, occurs during the Second Woe (Apoc. 9:12-11:13). The time from the end of the First Woe to the Beginning of the Third Woe (Apoc. 11:14) is given as 42 months or 1260 days (Apoc. 11:2-3). Therefore, because Holzhauser identifies the "mighty angel" of Apocalypse 10 (during the Second Woe) with the "Great Monarch" we can see that his Great Monarch comes AFTER the Antichrist who rises to power in Apocalypse 9 (during the First Woe). And there is some kind of respite, consolation, peace that occurs after the Great Monarch shows up, but it is for a very short period of time (probably weeks in our time).
I have demonstrated to my satisfaction and the satisfaction of others that you’re wrong and that the Saints are right. I’ll take Holhauzers interpretation over a man who claims the Pope is the Antichrist any day of the week. I do not pridefully assume that I alone have come to the correct interpretation, rather I submit to what wise theologians say. The Holy Roman Empire at times also controlled portions of modern day France. The empire of the Great Monarch will control all of Europe. This is on the timeline Buccanieri has on their site. They probably have the identity of the Great Monarch incorrect but still. Yet Holhauzer didn’t interpret the Antichrist coming before the Great Monarch. No one did, until recently. The book of the Apocalypse is symbolic. The Marian apparitions are straightforward and literal (usually because Mary is speaking to children). If you’re going to say one is symbolic it’s better to say the Bible is. My personal interpretation of the Apocalypse is very different from yours, but I don’t bring it up because I don’t think I’m called to infallibly interpret Scripture. I’m not a Protestant. No I won’t be taking message from schismatics. Anyone who claims that our Holy Father is the Antichrist, well, I don’t care about their opinion. Frankly I don’t believe someone like that should be on a Catholic forum. I’ll stick with the Saints and authentic mystics. Thanks.
This is from The Messages of The Lady of All Nations (New Edition 1999). The message is longer than this, and most websites only have a sentence or two quoted. Our Lady tells us: “…communism and a new kind of movement that will arise, a combination of the swastika and communism”. We have some problems with neo-Nazis but the police always intervene & they get charged for making Nazi salutes. It's also illegal to use swastika graffiti & have other Nazi symbols. If we keep praying & fasting they won't get a foothold. Jesus I trust in You 6th MESSAGE January 3, 1946 Fight in England and Europe I hear that voice say, “England, be on your guard!” Then I see England and in England a large church. I am given to understand: Westminster Abbey. Then I see a bishop; he is not of our Church. I am given to understand: that is a bishop of England. After this I see the Pope sitting before me; he looks very serious. Then I see that bishop again—this has to do with England. The Lady points out England to me, and then I see the word ‘Fight’ above the head of that bishop. A strange feeling overcomes me; it is as if everything within me were to change—I cannot explain how. I suddenly look up to my left and see the Lady again. She is dressed all in white, standing slightly above me. She is pointing something out to me. I look and I see England lying before me once more. The Lady says to me, “There will be a fight all over Europe and beyond.” A heavy, paralyzing feeling and a great spiritual weariness take hold of me. The Lady says, “It is a heavy spiritual fight.” Look at the Cross Then the Lady says to me, “Come”, and she points at my hand. It is as if a Cross were placed in it. Now the Lady indicates what I should do. I move the hand with the Cross in it over the earth, and I have to let the Cross be seen. Then the Lady says to me, “Yes, look at that Cross.” I do so and as I am looking, the Cross leaves my hand and I make a fist. I must look at that too. Then the Lady says, “Now look at the Cross again.” And the Cross is again lying in my hand. Then the Lady moves her finger to and fro in warning and says, “That Cross they want to change into other crosses.” Now I see several things whirling around before my eyes: communism and a new kind of movement that will arise, a combination of the swastika and communism.
So many things are playing out right before us now. I remember Maria Esperanza saying "It will begin in Venezuela". That was the horrific inflation. And I see it so much in the USA, I am sure it is all over the world. People can't afford food, housing, gas etc. It's hard to believe eggs are $12 a dozen. Then I hear of strange diseases and war. We had covid and now other diseases, measles outbreak, bird flu, bronchial flu has been rampant in the US. And now Pres. Trump and Zelenskyy falling apart. It is setting the stage for Russia to start marching on Europe . . .all of that was prophesies. A huge war killing millions of people. Not to mention the war in Israel/Gaza. And the bloodshed in Africa . . .the cartels all over south america infiltrating into the US and Canada. The weather upheavals all over the world, there are 400 percent more earthquakes now. Volcanoes erupting. But if I understand it, the Warning is supposed to precede WWIII. So, that would seem very soon I think. Never has there been a greater time for fasting and penance . . .oh, and possibly a new Pope in the near future. Things look very grim for Pope Francis. Things are coming fast and furious. And time itself seems like it is speeding faster. my thoughts for the day .
I might be mistaken, and certainly at this point, I am very confused about how the timeline goes, but I thought I read from variousmessages over the years that the Warning will occur when humanity is at its very worst, after an economic collapse, during a period of viral related lockdowns, at a time when nuclear weapons are beginning to be used (WWIII would start before that and reportedly the nukes would be the last part of the war, and would occur just at the point that God would intervene), and during a period of pandemonium in the Church (schism, pope going to Russia, maybe even the odious changing of the words of consecration that is refered to as the abomination of desolation).
The visionaries of Garabandal have said that the world will be at its worst when the Warning happens. It would be hard to say the Mass. However Our Lady said that there wouldn’t be a third world war at Garabandal and she never mentioned a virus.
