The Vatican Has Fallen

Discussion in 'Church Critique' started by padraig, Dec 31, 2016.

  1. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    The attack on marriage and the Real Presence in the eucharist, the open attack on Humanae Vitae, the use of Vatican organizations to spout global warming and population control agendas diametrically opposed to our Faith, giving awards to known abortionists and abortion promoters, the constant harangue of orthodox Catholics?

    I'm fed up!

    He will get no more of this overly scrupulous deference from me.

    He is a heretic and an enemy of the Gospel!
     
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  2. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Well that is something I cannot do in good conscience.
    And that is not my scrupulosity.

    Laying the title of heretic upon someone is something I do not think it is wise for any layman to do. In fact I think it can be detrimental to the person's soul. Notice that those with actual authority to do so do not even approach making a statement like that. I think that most of us have grown up in democracies where we feel free to label anyone and everything. Sometimes we are far too free in our use of language. We will be judged on every idle word we speak.
     
  3. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    This is disgusting and an absolute disgrace!
     
  4. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    There! Great! I knew you could do it!

    (Now you know why I had my dander up. This is getting ridiculous! And we're "bad" Catholics for calling a heretic and enemy of the Gospel exactly that?!?)
     
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  5. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

  6. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Something will give soon.
    They are moving faster and faster every day.
    Many in the hierarchy (and laity) are Catholic no longer.
    Indeed they do not even understand what it is to be Catholic.
     
    Light likes this.
  7. padraig

    padraig Powers

    I was praying about this to Our Lady about all this a few weeks back Brian and what I got back was this:

    The situation we are living in now is not to different than it was then. The religious authoriites were mostly either bad, evil or indifferent. Yet the Holy Family stayed subject to them.

    Jesus preached the truth yet they hung the Lamb of God up on a Cross.

    His leaving us seemed liked an Annihilation..BUT..

    Personally I have to agree ; Pope Francis is a arrant l heretic; I said this long ago; but its up to the Cardinals to act on this


    [​IMG]
     
  8. padraig

    padraig Powers

    I think we have to face up to this, Pope Francis really is a heretic, an out and out heretic; very, very bad news indeed. There's just no getting away from this. It's just a simple fact.

    If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck. There's just no good pretending it's not.

    He tries to do it with a certain stealth but the just makes him a thousand times more dangerous; that's just the way Satan does things. But at this stage of the game both himself his Cardinal buddies are way out in the open; they're all crazy far out heretics.

    I mean they look Martin Luther look cool. Martin was outside pissing in; these guys run the show and they're on the inside; at the top, pissing down on all of us.

    I'm sorry, that's just the way it is.


    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2018
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  9. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Just some ponderings I had on the Act of Contrition.

    It should be clear to anyone that the current Act of Contrition as it now stands is not merciful enough to fit into the new Church.

    The prayer as it currently reads:

    O my God, I am heartily sorry for having offended you and I detest all my sins, because of your punishments, but most of all because they offend you, my God, who are all-good and deserving of all my love. I firmly resolve, with the help of your grace, to sin no more and to avoid the near occasions of sin. Amen.

    That last sentence will need to be amended to read something along the lines of:

    However, I do not intend to avoid sinning again or avoid the near occasions of sin, but my situation is complicated so it’s okay.

    In fact maybe we should get rid of that whole “punishments” part as it seems pretty negative. Plus people might not really be totally sorry or they would amend their lives so that part has to go too.

    Maybe this could be the new prayer:

    Hey thanks for the forgiveness. I am a little sorry for some of the things I’ve done. I plan on committing adultery or some other sin right after I leave here, but I don’t think it’s that big a deal because everything is subjective, right? Plus sin is like really hard to avoid.
     
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  10. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    Yes, now so manifestly obvious, I frankly don’t need a cardinal to tell me or grant me permission to say it.
     
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  11. padraig

    padraig Powers


    ..and the title of the thread is..

    'The Vatican has Fallen'

    [​IMG]
     
    BrianK likes this.
  12. padraig

    padraig Powers

    'Pope Francis is confused' , 'Pope Francis is being mislead'

    I mean really get real.

    He's the real deal.

    I mean the real, real, real, really bad deal
     
  13. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    In charity the term heretic is only used today to describe someone guilty of formal heresy as opposed to material heresy. No one in the hierarchy has called Pope Francis a formal heretic.

    My personal opinion is that it is wiser to err on the side of caution. We all know what is going on and we all know that there are things being proposed in the Church which are not Catholic.

    https://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/heresy_schism_apostasy.htm

    Canon 1404 in the Code of Canon Law states that the First See is judged by no one, least of all me, so I will not be proclaiming the Pope a heretic.

    Can. 1404 The First See is judged by no one.
     
    An Guilbneach likes this.
  14. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    Yet.

    It is a disservice to faithful orthodox Catholics NOT to warn them that AL contains heresy and the recent publication of this pope’s letter to the Argentinian bishops confirming their heretical interpretation being called part of the magisterial teachings is itself heretical.

    I’m beyond scrupulously worrying about semantics.

    This pope is a heretic teaching heresy.

    I love Christ’s Real Presence in the Eucharist too much to stay silent in the face of the sacrilege being advanced by this papacy.
     
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  15. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Correct. We will see what we will see...
     
  16. Fatima

    Fatima Powers

    The point is Catholic teaching does develop, but it can never change. Pope Francis is clearly trying to change settled doctrine of the faith. Again, if a puppy becomes a dog that is development, but if a puppy becomes a cat that is change. One only has to look at how he is trying so hard to spin the truth on Adultery and somehow, long after the 6th commandment of God and long after Christ reiteration that "if any man divorce his wife and marries another he commits adultery" this doctrine can now be changed to reflect a more pastoral approach of appeasement to the modern world. Wake up before it is to late!! Not much time left before God's purification becomes global.
     
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  17. DeGaulle

    DeGaulle Powers

    No, he's not. He has been wily enough not to cross the line. He knows he might do so if he responds to the Dubia-hence, silence. Even if he appears to cross that line, it is not given to the likes of us on this website to deem him guilty of heresy. I, myself, have nothing like the sanctity or learning or authority to even consider the possibility of such a declaration. I will satisfy myself with disliking him and considering that, like many before him, he might be a sinful pope. He is, at a very best that I can't bring myself to uphold, completely misguided.
     
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  18. Don_D

    Don_D ¡Viva Cristo Rey!

    He knows exactly what he is doing. And so do these people who make excuses for it.
     
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  19. DeGaulle

    DeGaulle Powers

    We should all take Saint Paul's advice, but I see no advice there to disrespect authority. He did not tell us to disrespect angels from Heaven, but said that one will be accursed-God will sort it out. In the meantime, we just hold on to the Gospel Truth we have received from the Apostles and Saint Paul. I also read in these verses that we first choose to please God. That I assume to mean that we believe God's Truth no matter what the consequences from those humans who might not agree.

    All this seems consistent with the traditional teaching of the Church regarding obedience to authority. But it certainly indicates that there are limits to the jurisdiction of that authority over us.

    If a pope becomes a heretic, he automatically would cease to be pope, as I understand it, but this is not a decision any of us here are qualified to make, so we are obliged to rely on the authority of others who are. There is no getting away from obedience for we infantry types. We are only good for being prayer-fodder. To begin to reject authority per se would be to take a very blind step into the unknown. I'd be very wary of it.
     
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  20. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Very important point in both of these posts!
    Thank you!
     

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