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Discussion in 'The Signs of the Times' started by mothersuperior7, Jan 21, 2014.

  1. Indy

    Indy Praying

    Lots on Catholic Orthodox Unity here

    http://www.one-catholic-church.com/our-lady-of-soufanieh.html


    OUR LADY OF SOUFANIEH - RECOGNIZED A MIRACLE BY:
    The Antiochian Greek-Orthodox Patriarchate in Damascus, Syria
    His Beatitude Patriarch IGNATIUS IV (Hazim)
    The Ukrainian Autocephalous Orthodox Patriarchate in Kyiv, Ukraine
    His Beatitude Patriarch MOSES (Koulik) Approbations
    and Testimonials by: His Beatitude Patriarch ZAKKA I (Iwas) -
    Syrian Orthodox His Beatitude Patriarch MAXIMOS (Hakim) -
    Melkite Greek-Catholic His Beatitude Patriarch MOSES (Koulik) -
    Ukrainian Orthodox His Beatitude Patriarch GREGORY III (Laham) -
    Melkite Greek-Catholic Archbishop ISIDORE (Battikha) -
    Patriarchal Vical in Damascus Archbishop LUIGI (Accogli) -
    Apostolic Nuncio from The Vatican Archbishop GEORGE (Garmo) -
    Chaldean Catholic His Grace BOULOS (Pandeli) -
    Greek Orthodox His Grace Bishop YOUSEF (Al-Mounayer) -
    Syrian Catholic His Grace Bishop BOULOS (Coussa) - Armenian Catholic
     
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    The Splendor of the East! The Triumph and Magnificence of Holy Orthodoxy!

    Christ founded His One True Church...Orthodox in Faith & Catholic in Communion.

    From the Mother Church in Jerusalem to the Disciples "first being called Christians" in Antioch...nothing more can be said...

    NOTE: East & West needs to open their "ears to hear" and "eyes to see"...for this is a huge step the Pope is making to get the Roman Patriarchate back on Track!

    Are we not called to keep the mandate of Our Blessed Lord that "all may be one" and do this in spite of our personal feelings, suspicions or misunderstandings?

    Are we not to let the world know "we are Christians by our Love" and be Faithful Witnesses to the One, Holy, Catholic & Apostolic and ORTHODOX Church of the Seven Ecumenical Councils?

    Are we not obliged to fulfill the UNITY of the Church that Christ prayed for?

    In Truth...all Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Christians must acknowledge that the Body of Christ is ORTHODOX IN FAITH & CATHOLIC IN COMMUNION!

    Credit must be given to Rome's Spiritual Leader as he makes his stand against the "curial establishment"...as he literally "rocks the boat"...to heal the Body of Christ?

    In 2013, Pope Francis "invited all Christians, everywhere, at this very moment, to a renewed personal encounter with Jesus Christ..."

    The Pope quoted from Vatican Council II: "Every renewal of the Church essentially consists in an increase of fidelity to her own calling...Christ summons the Church as she goes her pilgrim way...to that continual reformation of which she always has need, in so far as she is a human institution here on earth." (from Decree on Ecumenism - "UNITATIS REDINTEGRATIO, 6")

    Furthermore, Francis made it quite clear that, "without new life and an authentic evangelical spirit,, without the Church's 'fidelity to her own calling,' any new structure will soon prove ineffective." He reaffirmed that, "the papacy and the central structures of the universal Church also need to hear the call to pastoral conversion...like the ancient Patriarchal Churches..."

    We invite you to be our "friend" and share our support for Church UNITY based on Holy Orthodoxy and the Deposit of Faith as was given to the Apostles by Our Blessed Lord..."One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism..."...there can be no other way...

    IT IS JUST THAT SIMPLE...PERIOD!!!

    www.one-catholic-church.com
     
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    Blessed John XXIII was also a great forerunner in paving the way of UNITY, especially between Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Christians.

    Let us prayer for Pope Francis, that he and Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew I will complete the work of Pope Paul VI and Patriarch Athenagoras I when they met on the shores of the Jordan River in Jerusalem in 1964 and fulfill the prayer of Christ for His Holy Church that "all may be one."

    Get the facts: www.one-catholic-church.com
    Blessed John XXIII was also a great forerunner in paving the way of UNITY, especially between Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Christians.

    Let us prayer for Pope Francis, that he and Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew I will complete the work of Pope Paul VI and Patriarch Athenagoras I when they met on the shores of the Jordan River in Jerusalem in 1964 and fulfill the prayer of Christ for His Holy Church that "all may be one."

    Get the facts: www.one-catholic-church.com
     
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    God Bless the Holy Father and all that stand with him!

    I have no doubt that this Pope has been chosen by Almighty God to walk in Faith with his brother Bartholomew, the Ecumenical Patriarch, to fulfill the prayer of Christ that "all be one" and be that shining example of Christian love & witness to the world.

    For our Holy Mother Church has been through much but the gates of Hell have not prevailed. Yes, true love is from God and is never lost but simply misplaced. And, through the efforts of Pope Francis and Patriarch Bartholomew, they will take that love and, together, guided by the Holy Spirit, represent to the world Christ's beautiful Bride...the ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC & APOSTOLIC CHURCH!

    My brothers and sisters, either we believe what our Churches teach or we don't!

    If the Blessed Sacrament IS the "source and summit" of our Faith, and if both Roman Catholics & Eastern Orthodox Christians have the same valid Apostolic Succession...the same Mystical Supper/Holy Sacrifice...the same Immaculate Body and Precious Blood of the Saviour housed in the tabernacles on our Altars, then isn't it the very same Blood of Christ flowing through our veins after we receive Holy Communion? How can we not be truly one already?

    The answer to these vital questions...and many others like it...are the "secrets" of the Popes & Patriarchs that are documented in my upcoming book.

    These are the vital facts that every Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Christian NEEDS TO KNOW...so we can "look Truth in the eye" as said by Blessed John Paul II and stand with our Spiritual Leaders to see this blessed UNITY in 2014!

    Please...if any of my words make sense to you then please visit my website atwww.beingcatholicthebook.com and do tell others about it.

    Remember, as Holy Scripture says, "a house divided against itself cannot stand."

    May Almighty God Bless each of you and join our Sincere Plea for UNITY of the Church and to fulfill the work of the New Evangelization.

    Father Michael
     
  5. SteveD

    SteveD Guest

    1. Although Catholics are permitted to receive Communion in Orthodox churches, the Orthodox are not permitted to offer Communion to Catholics and so we are advised not to receive in their churches so as not to offend them. The Orthodox Churches (plural) do not permit their members to receive Communion in Catholic Churches under any circumstances, though the Church would be willing to offer it.

    2. The Greek Orthodox Church does not recognise Catholic orders at all (and neither do some ROC priests and bishops). When Pope Benedict was considering a visit to Cyprus, the GOC patriarch said that he would be happy to greet the Pope but only as a layman.

    3. Some Orthodox churches, though recognised by the Patriarch of Constantinople, do not recognise each other (the independent Churches in the former Baltic USSR republics are not recognised by the ROC but Bartholomew does recognise them and he is supposed to be the 'last word' - but is ignored when politics intervene)

    4. The ROC has tried, for decades, to usurp the authority of Bartholomew and tends to ignore him. Certainly any moves toward reconciliation with Rome by the Patriarch would be ignored by both the ROC and GOC whose members outnumber those of all other EO Churches by far .

    5. With this degree of disunity among themselves, there is no hope for early unity between east and west (and we already enjoy union with the Uniate Churches who have eastern liturgy but with full communion).

    6. We should be seeking unity with the Oriental Orthodox (Copts) as we have fewer theological problems with them and they need the protection of the Catholic Church against Islam.

    Taking seriously, then, Our Divine Savior's dying wish for the full unity of His Church, the Fathers of the Second Vatican Council -- taking their lead from Pope John XXIII -- set forth Christian unity as a central goal of the Catholic Church. But likewise faithful to the Lord's wishes, the bishops of the council warned against an unreal and counterproductive form of ecumenism, which sought to ignore genuine and essential differences among the contemporary disciples of Christ: "Nothing is so foreign to the spirit of ecumenism as a false irenicism which harms the purity of Catholic doctrine and obscures its genuine and certain meaning" (Vatican II, Decree on Ecumenism, no. 11). Therefore, as the Church looks toward the third millennium, she has one eye fixed on the reunion of all who glory in the name of Christ, while the other eye is equally fixed on the full and saving truth of the deposit of faith.

    http://www.stjohn17v20-21.com/prophet1.htm

    SO LET'S NOT GET CARRIED AWAY!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2014
    sunburst and Mac like this.
  6. Bernadette

    Bernadette Archangels

    I read at the vigil Mass today for the first time in years and I thought about this thread when I read the second reading:

    "I urge you, brothers and sisters, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree in what you say, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and in the same purpose. For it has been reported to me about you, my brothers and sisters, by Chloes people, that there are rivalries among you. I mean that each of you is saying, "I belong to Paul", or "I belong to Apollos", or "I belong to Cephas," or I belong to Christ." Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel and not with the wisdom of human eloquence, so that the cross of Christ might not be emptied of its meaning.

    I remember when Pope John Paul II became pope I was at first terrified because even though I was about 12 at the time I knew he came from a communist country and already was aware of Fatima and communism. But I remember how quickly that feeling dissipated when I realized he was special. I remember how quickly communism fell and it seemed almost effortlessly done although I know that was not the case.

    I think that this will happen with unity. With prayer and sacrifice then anything is possible with God. And when he answers prayer it is swift. Please do not be divided. I think that is is perfectly reasonable to expect the churches to be united. In fact I have been praying for this before this thread ever mentioned it. A lot of my friends are of various denominations and although we never speak of things which divide us we all agree we are on the verge of something big about to happen with God and his Church. Most religious believe the end of times is near and are just waiting for the manifestations to begin. I just never say "Oh by the way you're all going to be Catholic when this is all said and done!"

    God Bless!
     
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  7. Mac

    Mac Guest

    Bernadette said...... "Oh by the way you're all going to be Catholic when this is all said and done!"

    Im so pleased to hear that.:)
    Will the orthodox be aware of this?
     
  8. Mac

    Mac Guest

  9. Mac

    Mac Guest

  10. Mac

    Mac Guest

    Thanks for the links Indy, I only looked a small bit ,so could some believer confirm what I thought I viewed. Our Lady wants us to join the Orthodox who have remained true?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2014
  11. sunburst

    sunburst Powers

  12. Mac

    Mac Guest

    Lol ,perhaps your right, very hard to 'Dialogue' with my head in the sand.
     
    sunburst likes this.
  13. So, after all this research the question came to mind...so, where do you think the 'Great Apostasy' is going to come from? I'm thinking, it just might come from this UNION/UNITY....hmmmm.....what do you think??

    Pope Francis is gearing up for this unity. We better be on that bandwagon.
     
  14. Mac likes this.
  15. Mac

    Mac Guest

    MS asked..where do you think the 'Great Apostasy' is going to come from?

    You already know the answer to this.

    The Great Apostasy will start at the' T..'
     
  16. Indy

    Indy Praying

    Well Mirna is Roman Catholic although her husband is Orthodox but she is the focus of all the apparitions as I assumed unity would be under the Roman Pope.
     
  17. Indy

    Indy Praying

    Could someone point me to prophecies about the great apostasy. Because for me growing up in Ireland in the Eighties everyone went to mass then come the late nineties very few of my peers were going to mass. This I always thought was the great apostasy. Is there another one?
     
  18. Indy

    Indy Praying

    I did some reading.

    2 Thessalonians 2

    1 About the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, brothers, and our being gathered to him:
    2 please do not be too easily thrown into confusion or alarmed by any manifestation of the Spirit or any statement or any letter claiming to come from us, suggesting that the Day of the Lord has already arrived.
    3 Never let anyone deceive you in any way. It cannot happen until the Great Revolt has taken place and there has appeared the wicked One, the lost One,
    4 the Enemy, who raises himself above every so-called God or object of worship to enthrone himself in God's sanctuary and flaunts the claim that he is God.

    Some commentary from Haydock.

    Ver. 3-4. First, &c.[2] What is meant by this falling away, (in the Greek this apostacy) is uncertain, and differently expounded. St. Jerome and others understand it of a falling off of other kingdoms, which before were subject to the Roman empire; as if St. Paul said to them: you need not fear that the day of judgment is at hand, for it will not come till other kingdoms, by a general revolt, shall have fallen off, so that the Roman empire be destroyed. The same interpreters expound the sixth and seventh verses in like manner, as if when it is said, now you know[3] what withholdeth, &c. That is, you see the Roman empire subsisteth yet, which must be first destroyed. And when it is added, only that he who now holdeth, do hold, until he be taken out of the way; the sense, say these authors, is, let Nero and his successors hold that empire till it be destroyed, for not till then will the day of judgment come. Cornelius a Lapide makes this exposition so certain, that he calls it a tradition of the fathers, which to him seems apostolical. But we must not take the opinion of some fathers, in the exposition of obscure prophecies, where they advance conjectures (which others at the same time reject, or doubt of) to be apostolical traditions, and articles of faith, as the learned bishop of Meaux, Bossuet, takes notice on this very subject, in his preface and treatise on the Apocalypse, against Jurieux. St. Jerome indeed, and others, thought that the Roman empire was to subsist till the antichrist's coming, which by the event most interpreters conclude to be a mistake, and that it cannot be said the Roman empire continues to this time. See Lyranus on this place, St. Thomas Aquinas, Salmeron, Estius, and many others; though Cornelius a Lapide, with some few, pretend the Roman empire still subsists in the emperors of Germany. We also find that divers of the ancient fathers thought that the day of judgment was just at hand in their time. See Tertullian, St. Cyprian, St. Gregory the Great, &c. And as to this place, it cannot be said the fathers unanimously agree in their exposition. St. Chrysostom[4], Theodoret, St. Augustine in one of his expositions, by this falling off, and apostacy, understand antichrist himself, apostatizing from the Catholic faith. And they who expound it of Nero, did not reflect that this letter of St. Paul was written under Claudius, before Nero's reign. According to a third and common exposition, by this revolt or apostacy, others understand a great falling off of great numbers from the Catholic Church and faith, in those nations where it was professed before; not but that, as St. Augustine expressly takes notice, the Church will remain always visible, and Catholic in its belief, till the end of the world. This interpretation we find in St. Cyril[5] of Jerusalem. (Catech. 15.) See also St. Anselm on this place, St. Thomas Aquinas, Salmeron, Estius, &c. In fine, that there is no apostolical tradition, as to any of the interpretations of these words, we may be fully convinced from the words of St. Augustine[6], lib. xx. de Civ. Dei. chap. 19. t. 7. p. 597. Nov. edit., where he says: For my part, I own myself altogether ignorant what the apostle means by these words; but I shall mention the suspicions of others, which I have read, or heard. Then he sets down the exposition concerning the Roman empire. He there calls that a suspicion and conjecture, which others say is an apostolical tradition. In like manner the ancient fathers are divided, as to the exposition of the words of the sixth and seventh verse, when it is said you know what hindereth; some understand that antichrist must come first. Others, that the beforementioned apostacy, or falling off from the Church, must happen before. And when St. Paul says, (ver. 7.) that he who now holdeth, do hold; some expound it, let him take care at the time of such trials, to hold, and preserve the true faith to the end. When the expositions are so different, as in this place, whosoever pretends to give a literal translation ought never to add words to the text, which determine the sense to such a particular exposition, and especially in the same print, as Mr. N. hath done on the seventh verse, where he translates, only let him that now holdeth the faith, keep it until he be taken out of the way. --- And the man of sin[7] revealed, the son of perdition, so that he sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself as if he were God. He is called again, (ver. 8.) that wicked one....whom the Lord Jesus Christ shall kill with the spirit of his mouth. By all these words is described to us the great antichrist, about the end of the world, according to the unexceptionable authority and consent of the ancient fathers. It is as ridiculous as malicious to pretend, with divers later reformers, that the pope, and all the popes since the destruction of the Roman empire, are the great antichrist, the man of sin, &c. Grotius, Dr. Hammond, and divers learned Protestants, have confuted and ridiculed this groundless fable, of which more on the Apocalypse. It may suffice to observe here that antichrist, the man of sin, the son of perdition, the wicked one, according to all the ancients, is to be one particular man, not so many different men. That he is to come a little while before the day of judgment. That he will make himself be adored, and pretend to be God. What pope did so? That he will pretend to be Christ, &c. (Witham) --- St. Augustine (de Civ. Dei. book xx. chap. 19.) says, that an attack would be made at one and the same time against the Roman empire and the Church. The Roman empire subsists as yet, in Germany, though much weakened and reduced. The Roman Catholic Church, notwithstanding all its losses, and the apostacy of many of its children, has always remained the same. (Calmet) — The two special signs of the last day will be a general revolt, and the manifestation of antichrist, both of which are so dependent on each other, that St. Augustine makes but one of both. What presumptive folly in Calvin and other modern reformers, to oppose the universal sentiments of the fathers both of the Latin and Greek Church! What inconsistency, to give such forced interpretations, not only widely different from the expositions of sound antiquity, but also widely different from each other! The Church of God, with her head, strong in the promises of Jesus Christ, will persevere to the end, frustra circumlatrantibus hæreticis. (St. Augustine, de util. cred. chap. xvii.) --- In the temple. Either that of Jerusalem, which some think he will rebuild; or in some Christian Church, which he will pervert to his own worship; as Mahomet has done with the churches of the east. (Challoner)


    From:
    http://haydock1859.tripod.com/id224.html

    Not sure there is a link here to Catholic and Orthodox unity though.
     

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