Why the Traditional Latin Mass and not the Novus Ordo Mass

Discussion in 'The Sacraments' started by SgCatholic, Nov 29, 2019.

  1. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    Prayer of the Crusade of Reparation to the Eucharistic Heart of Jesus

    My God, I believe, I adore, I trust, and I love you! I ask pardon for those who do not believe, do not adore, do not trust and do not love you. (3 times)

    O Divine Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, behold us prostrate with a contrite and adoring heart before the majesty of your redeeming love in the Most Blessed Sacrament. We declare our readiness to atone by voluntary expiation, not only for our own personal offenses, but in particular for the unspeakable outrages, sacrileges, and indifferences by which you are offended in the Most Blessed Sacrament of your Divine love in this our time, especially through the practice of Communion in the hand and the reception of Holy Communion in a state of unbelief and mortal sin.

    The more unbelief attacks your Divinity and your Real Presence in the Eucharist, the more we believe in you and adore you, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, in Whom dwells all the fullness of the divinity!

    The more your sacraments are outraged, the more firmly we believe in them and the more reverently we want to receive them, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, fountain of life and holiness!

    The more your Most Blessed Sacrament is denigrated and blasphemed, the more we proclaim solemnly: “My God, I believe, I adore, I trust, and I love you! I ask pardon for for those who do not believe, do not adore, do not trust and do not love you,” O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, most worthy of all praise!

    The more you are abandoned and forgotten in your churches, the more we want to visit you, who are dwelling amongst us in the tabernacles of our churches, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, House of God and Gate of Heaven!

    The more the celebration of the Eucharistic Sacrifice is deprived of its sacredness, the more we want to support a reverent celebration of Holy Mass, exteriorly and interiorly oriented towards you, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, Tabernacle of the Most High!

    The more you are received in the hand of standing communicants, in a manner lacking a sign of humility and adoration, the more we want to receive you kneeling and on the tongue, with the lowliness of the publican and the simplicity of an infant, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, of infinite majesty!

    The more you are received in Holy Communion by uncleansed hearts in the state of mortal sin, the more we want to do acts of contrition and cleanse our heart with a frequent reception of the Sacrament of Penance, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, our Peace and Reconciliation!

    The more hell works for the perdition of souls, the more may our zeal for their salvation burn by the fire of your love, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, salvation of those who hope in you!

    The more the diversity of religions is declared as the positive will of God and as a right based in human nature, and the more doctrinal relativism grows, the more we intrepidly confess that you are the only Savior of mankind and the only way to God the Father, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, King and center of all hearts!

    The more Church authorities continue to be unrepentant about the display of pagan idols in churches, and even in Rome, the more we will confess the truth: “What agreement has the temple of God with idols?” (2 Cor. 6:16), the more we will condemn with you “the abomination of desolation, standing in the holy place” (Matt. 24:15), O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, holy Temple of God!

    The more your holy commandments are forgotten and transgressed, the more we want to observe them with the help of your grace, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, abyss of all virtues!

    The more sensuality, selfishness, and pride reign amongst men, the more we want to dedicate our lives to you in the spirit of sacrifice and self-abnegation, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, overwhelmed with reproaches!

    The more violently the gates of hell storm against your Church and the rock of Peter in Rome, the more we believe in the indestructibility of your Church, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, source of all consolation, who do not abandon your church and the rock of Peter even in the heaviest storms!

    The more people separate from each other in hatred, violence, and selfishness, the more intimately we as members of the one family of God in the Church want to love each other in you, O Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, full of goodness and love!

    O Divine Eucharistic Heart of Jesus, grant us your grace, that we may be faithful and humble adorers, lovers, defenders, and consolers of your Eucharistic Heart in this life, and come to receive the glories of your love in the beatific vision for all eternity. Amen.

    My God, I believe, I adore, I trust, and I love you! I ask pardon for for those who do not believe, do not adore, do not trust and do not love you. (3 times)

    Our Lady of the Blessed Sacrament, pray for us!

    St. Thomas Aquinas, St. Peter Julian Eymard, St. Francisco Marto, St. Padre Pio, and all Eucharistic Saints, pray for us!

    Written by Bishop Athanasius Schneider for this Eucharistic Reparation Crusade

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  2. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    Bishop Schneider makes a suggestion to combat abuses. It is edifying that a member of the hierarchy has offered a spiritual solution. Thank God. And his request is reasonable.
    One hour of Adoration and reparation per month. We can do even more than that.
    AED, Don_D, Sam and 1 other person like this.
  3. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    Why Liturgy Really is the Key to Everything
    Steve Skojec August 26, 2020 75 Comments

    There is nothing so great as the Eucharist. If God had something more precious, He would have given it to us.

    – Saint Jean-Marie Vianney


    It is therefore inescapable that a proper understanding of liturgy grounds us in a correct knowledge of our place in the universe. Liturgy that emphasizes Our Lord’s Sacrifice and places us mentally and spiritually before the Cross on Calvary humbles us and makes us receptive to our absolute dependence on God for all good things, especially our salvation. Liturgy where priest and people alike are oriented toward Heaven and where sacred things are veiled and shrouded and reverenced in an appropriate way teaches us who we are — and what duties we have — in relation to Him from Whom all good things come and in Whom we must trust when we have no choice but to walk by faith rather than by sight. Liturgy should make us feel small, like entering the great edifices of Christendom.

    The attack on the liturgy that we have witnessed over the past half-century can be understood as nothing less than a diabolical attempt to strike at the heart of our most important and intimate connection with Our Creator — and also to confuse and disorient us through this loss of perspective. We have been given over to idolatry – the idolatry of self, such that we see the world only through the lens of our own desires. Christ’s sacrifice has been replaced with food and fellowship, His altar of oblation turned into a table, His priesthood adulterated by those persons who intrude upon the domain of the priest but do not possess the ability to act in persona Christi, the universal orientation of priest and people toward God turned inward so that we are, in essence, all just talking to ourselves, and nearly every act of reverence for the sacred has been stripped away.

    Christ remains present in this reinvented, banalized, man-centered liturgy, but He is ignored, forgotten, abused, and upstaged. Like Cain, we no longer offer God our best, but keep it for ourselves. Anyone who attempts to offer God what He deserves, like Abel, is met with envy, contempt, and even violence.

    The crisis in the Church is manifestly a crisis of selfishness and anthropocentrism. It is the fruit of this new idolatry. We have come to believe that we know better than God what is best for us. The Second Vatican Council tells us, “[A]ll things on earth should be related to man as their center and crown.” We must reject this. All things on Earth should be related to Christ as their center and crown. We are not worshipers of man; we are worshipers of Jesus Christ! Of the Blessed Trinity! But if our liturgies fail to hold God as our object of adoration, is it any wonder that we have become obsessed with ourselves? We talk incessantly about how we “feel” about liturgy and what we “get out of it” and whether it “moves us” – but for Whom are we there?

    The architects of the Church’s “new and improved” liturgy knew exactly what they were doing. And they have been successful. They have, with a single stroke, moved the entire liturgical edifice of the Church to a foundation of sand. And now that this edifice is crumbling to the ground, and the faith along with it, they swoop in, telling us that the other truths of our faith are nothing more than “ideals” too hard to live up to, that because things have strayed so far, we must now find ways to accept and work with situations “as they are.” By destroying our understanding of our relationship with God through the central act of prayer of the Church, they have undermined all else besides. Now, after half a century of demolition, they are dismantling what’s left of the faith almost unopposed.


    While it is true that good liturgy alone will never be a panacea, there is nonetheless nothing more powerful you can do for your faith, for your understanding of what is happening in the world, for the good of your soul and those of your loved ones, than to stop, without delay, attending a liturgy that was designed to separate you from the very Sacrifice it is supposed to commemorate. You cannot drink poisoned water without ill effect, no matter how thirsty you are, or how resilient. It does not nourish; it emaciates.

    The new paradigm is collapsing on itself even now. It will be abandoned in our lifetimes, a husk of what it once was — or else rendered unrecognizable to anyone with faith as it becomes, like the Arian churches of the 4th century, the exclusive domain of the enemies of Our Lord.

    The liturgy is the key to our entire understanding of what we face, of who we are, and of what we must do. There may well be no other way to weather what is coming. More importantly, it is our most essential interaction with God. We have a duty to find a place where the priest and the people worship God in a way that is fitting and pleasing to Him. Once it is found, flee to it. Cling to it. Do not worry about the hardships you must endure to accomplish this, for God knows these things, and He will bless you.

    Be reminded of your place in the universe. Be subject to Him Who rules it. Love Him with all your heart, mind, and strength, and adore Him as He deserves. It’s a decision you’ll never regret.

    For the full article, go to:

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  4. AidanK

    AidanK A great sinner

    Why was it decided sixty years ago that the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass of 1900 years , the Mass which generations of faithful Christians shed their blood for, needed changing and was by implication less than perfect?
    SgCatholic, padraig and BrianK like this.
  5. this Rite did not have 1900 years of history, this is a rite from the Council of Trent. in fact this church desired by traditionalists is a very specific church, which is the Latin church of the 18th and 19th century. the catholic church was never just that
  6. AidanK

    AidanK A great sinner

    The NO is a commemorative meal whereas the Mass Of The Ages is a bloodless repeat of the crucifiction, death and resurrection of Our Lord Jesus Christ.
    SgCatholic likes this.
  7. padraig

    padraig New Member

    There is a story I heard about Pope Saint John 23rd. When he was a Cardinal he was visiting Rome and walking through the streets when he was caught in a shower of heavy rain and sheltered in a shop doorway. Sheltering there was a French priest who was part of the great reform movement they were haivng their at the period immediate before Vatican 2, I suppose the late 50's earlier 60's. Anyway it was this priest who put the flea in Poep johns ear about changing elements of the Mass into the Vernacular.

    When Vatican 2 was underway Pope St John monitored it by TV and sent a signal that the Liturgy could be changed by introducing the prayer to St Joseph into the Canon. This was the door that opened to change.

    But it was never the intention that things would change as it did. Folks just ran with the ball so to speak.
    AED likes this.
  8. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Archangels

    I would like to know if there is any custom of the traditionalists to pray facing the East in a similar way to the priest celebrating Mass in the ancient rite.
    padraig likes this.
  9. padraig

    padraig New Member

    Praying Ad Orientem is at the centre of the Old Rite. That is why we used to build our Churches as we did to ensure this.

    It just occurs to me that the Great Sign in the Heavens before the Illumination of Conscience will come from the East.


  10. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    Cardinal: Archbishop Lefebvre Will One Day Be Recognized as a Doctor of the Church; Was “Prophetic”
    August 27, 2020
    Dr Maike Hickson


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  11. AidanK

    AidanK A great sinner

  12. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    I'm praying for that intention every day.
    May God grant it soon.

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  13. AidanK

    AidanK A great sinner

    The SSPX is very active in Asia especially the Militia Immaculata
  14. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    I admit that I'm fairly new to the SSPX and don't know much about the Militia Immaculata, although it happens that I just bought a set of books on Marian meditations from the MI's bookstore/ corner within the SSPX priory here today.

  15. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    The Problem of the "Reverent Novus Ordo"

    Thursday, September 10, 2020



    For much of my life as a Catholic, I attended what most would call a "reverent Novus Ordo." For some Catholics who have never seen a NO that wasn't a clown show, the concept of a reverent Novus Ordo may come as a surprise, but I assure you they exist, though they are rare. What does a reverent Novus Ordo look like? In my experience, they may incorporate some or all of the following elements:

    • The ordinary of the Mass said or sung in Latin
    • Exclusive use of the Roman Canon ("Eucharistic Prayer 1")
    • Prevalence of women veiling
    • Chant replacing hymns
    • A Latin introit
    • An asperges rite
    • Beautiful vestments
    • Almost exclusive reception of Holy Communion on the tongue
    • Centrally located tabernacle
    • Reception of communion kneeling at altar rails
    • Solid, sacrificial looking altar (i.e., no flimsy "table altar")
    • Beautiful, traditional architecture and decorum
    • Orthodox preaching and catechesis
    • Traditionally vested male altar servers
    • Cultivation of spirituality that is Marian and Eucharistic
    • Congregation dressed appropriately and reverently
    • St. Michael Prayer after Mass

    I have been consistent over the years in my opinion that the Novus Ordo is not intrinsically irreverent; that is. We know a statistical majority of Novus Ordo liturgies are cringy at best and irreverent at worst, but still the NO can theoretically be celebrated in a way that befits the dignity of the liturgy. Maybe you disagree with this, but whatever. That's not the point of this essay. And of course, the Traditional Latin Mass is superior in this regard in every way, and that is without dispute. But the point is that it is possible to celebrate the Novus Ordo in a way that is reverent and dignified, and that for many Catholics these sorts of Novus Ordo liturgies constitute a real and positive source of spiritual nourishment and offer a true, if very imperfect, connection with the Catholic tradition.

    However, even if this is all true...it's an awful defense of the Novus Ordo. There is one overarching reason that looms like an elephant in the room—the fact that even the best Novus Ordo liturgy is only such because of the personal preference of the celebrant.

    The rubrics of the Novus Ordo definitely allow for a reverent celebration. But the word "allow" is the crux of the problem. It allows for all the most reverent options if the celebrant so chooses to use them. And the same rubrics that allow for reverence just as easily allows for the most banal, goofy, or irreverent options if the celebrant so chooses. The Novus Ordo is liturgically libertarian. It elevates the principle of choice for the sake of choice as the determining principle of the liturgy. This ensures that the quality of one's liturgical experience is determined not by the structure of the rite itself, but by the whims of the celebrant. Even when the celebrant chooses to use the most reverent options—which might be good for that particular liturgy—overall it is a bad state of affairs because the stability of that "reverent Novus Ordo" is always in question.

    To be blunt, this means that only one person stands between that reverent Novus Ordo and the complete upending of the parish's liturgical life. A few examples from my own history:

    My parish had a traditional pastor for over a decade. He did what I would describe as a "reverent" Novus Ordo, and (after the promulgation of Summorum Pontificum) he also celebrated the Traditional Latin Mass. All his liturgies of both forms used the neo-gothic high altar. The parish did have a table altar, but the pastor had removed this and put it in storage. Well eventually, that pastor left and we were assigned a temporary parish administrator until a permanent pastor was assigned. The interim guy immediately put the table altar back. Both clerics could cite documents in support of their decisions: the original pastor rightly noted that the text of the Missale Romanum assumes that the celebrant is facing ad orientam and hence presumes a fixed wall altar, not a table altar. The interim administrator could cite the GIRM, which specifically says that the altar "should be built separate from the wall, in such a way that it is possible to walk around it easily and that Mass can be celebrated at it facing the people" (GIRM 299). It all depended on the personality and preferences of each man, which document they chose to go by, and how they interpreted said documents. When a new pastor was finally assigned, he (again) removed the table altar. If he ever leaves, a new pastor could just as easily put it back again.

    Another story: Years earlier, when I first returned to the Church, I was attending Mass at what was then the most traditional parish in my region. The pastor said a Latin Novus Ordo, where everything other than the readings and homily was chanted in Latin. I loved this. It was my first exposure to anything approximating the Catholic liturgical tradition. Well, eventually that pastor was removed and we got another one, a very low-energy "don't rock the boat" sort of guy. Prime bishop-material. Anyhow, once the new priest got in, guess what was the first thing to go? I don't think Latin has been spoken in that parish ever since.

    The point is this: Even when the Novus Ordo is done reverently, it is as an exercise of the pastor's personal taste—and the elevation of the celebrant's preference above all other considerations is perhaps the original sin of Novus Ordoism. The Novus Ordo at its best is still an exemplar of what is worst about it. What bizarre irony.

    How different is this from the Traditional Latin Mass, where the celebrant becomes irrelevant! The reverence of the Traditional Latin Mass is not the product of subjective preference, but is built into the structure of the rite itself. The Traditional Mass does not have a contingent "allowance" for reverence; it simply is reverent. The reverence isn't the product of getting just the right pastor in, building the right congregation over the years, and making the right choices amongst a sea of options. The reverence of the Traditional Latin Mass is not the end to be attained, but a foundation that is taken for granted and built upon. It is where we begin, not where we end.

    Reverent liturgy is not something Catholics should have to fight for, much less leave to the whims of one man's liturgical preferences. It should be our birthright as sons and daughters of the Church.

    Posted by Boniface


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