Protestants shifting blame…

Such can be found within God's Prophesy and Church Magisterium Teachings.
Jesus wants disciples of Him..
Prayerfully Devouring His GOSPEL gives us Fortitude Strength and Palpible Hope.
Inculcating into one's Mind & Heart Jesus' Return and God's Kingdom IS Coming - goes a very long way.

PEACE IN JESUS (who is inside us)..

 

SERIOUS trouble in the Church in our countries in our families. May God save His people!

 

How are the leaders of the church the bishops, cardinals and the Pope not able to discern evil spirits?

Do they pray?
Do they know God intimately?
Do they have a living faith?

We lay people on this forum would run a mile from pachamama and Indian spirit worship. We can sense the evil in these things.

I am thinking the rosary and devotion to our Lady is the bulwark against diabolical disorientation in these times.

 

Like so many appalling things nowadays, one is left asking oneself is it a bug or a feature.

 

There is a difference between believing that is kind of vague consent and a living Faith that is based on a Personal Relationship with Jesus as Lord and Saviour.

The first is kind of like belong to a golf club or library.

The second is being part of a family as a Child of God.

The Golf Club membership leaves you still blind.

The personal family relationship leaves you with eyes of an eagle.

 

It occurs to me that if an ordinary Catholic involves themselves in witchcraft it is very, very bad indeed.

If a priest involves himself in witchcraft it is a thousand times worse.

If a Bishop involves himself in witchcraft it is a thousand times worse again.

If a Cardinal involves himself in witchcraft a thousand times worse again.

But if a Pope becomes involves in witchcraft we have entered a whole new world of wickedness. For the Pope as Head of the Church by taking part in witchcraft to some extent leads us all into this evil.

Only time will tell how many uncounted demons have been released from hell on account of this.

The last time he took part in Witchcraft with Pachamama the virus broke out almost right away.

Only the goodness knows what we will get hit with this time round.

Interesting that there were seven Cardinals at this. Seven being a Holy Number (the seven spirits who sit in the presence of God).

 

I was googling the 'Grandmother of the West', but the only Indian Spirit/Demon I can find like it is Grandmother Spider Woman who looks totally horrific.

Spider is one of the seven signs of Satan in which he appears as an animal, like rat, goat, fly, snake, dog and so on...

The Spider Woman or Spider Grandmother appears to be Worshipped in several tribes.

 

Those with God's Holy Spirit within? Easily see Sin and recoil from it..
There are those who are unwittingly led away from God's Holy Spirit..
There are those who either knowingly/purposely or unwittingly? preach Apostasy - - such as some Jesuits which I've encountered - 0ften to the ill-catechised .. which if accepted acts as a block to God's Holy Spirit

Becoming very very familiar with Jesus and His Teachings as per God's Gospel - and Obedient to them - is IMBelief the greatest Shield against Evil

 

If these aren't demons, it's all a matter.

Wasn't there a film made some years ago called "Kiss of the Spiderwoman"? I never saw it, nor do I know much about it, but I doubt it was very edifying.

 

This nonesense makes me so angry.

They are making a mockery of Christ's church.

Dear God this stuff is just unbelievable, calling down unclean spirits -

I noticed too that PF had a wee sneaky look to see if others were participating in the debacle.


God shall not be mocked.

 

I don't see how they can be praying and not see doing such evil as an abomination. I always remember a story Fr. Corapi told about a bishop and Mother Teresa. They were taking Mother Teresa somewhere in a car and the bishop went on and on about all the great things he was doing while Mother Teresa and a sister sat praying with their beads. Finally he ended with why Mother Teresa, I'm so busy, I don't have time to pray. Without missing a beat Mother Teresa looked straight at him and said --bishop if you're too busy to pray, you're too busy. You cannot discern anything if you are not praying.

 

Well said re: Mother Teresa!

Even the devils have faith (ie to the level that they know God/Jesus exists) and anyone can Pray.
But Prayers require certain conditions in order to be fulfilled.. Such as having solid Faith In Jesus along with no doubt that their petitions shall be fulfilled.
Even then? God the Father didn't remove the cup from Jesus - when He was on the Cross.
Jesus' Prayer included,. "but not my will but Thine be done"

 

Final judgement doesn't occur until after the beast and false prophet have been thrown into the lake of fire and the devil has been bound for "1000 years"

Revelation 20:
[7] And when the thousand years shall be finished, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, and shall go forth, and seduce the nations, which are over the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, and shall gather them together to battle, the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. [8] And they came upon the breadth of the earth, and encompassed the camp of the saints, and the beloved city. [9] And there came down fire from God out of heaven, and devoured them; and the devil, who seduced them, was cast into the pool of fire and brimstone, where both the beast [10] And the false prophet shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

[11] And I saw a great white throne, and one sitting upon it, from whose face the earth and heaven fled away, and there was no place found for them. [12] And I saw the dead, great and small, standing in the presence of the throne, and the books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged by those things which were written in the books, according to their works. [13] And the sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hell gave up their dead that were in them; and they were judged every one according to their works. [14] And hell and death were cast into the pool of fire. This is the second death. [15] And whosoever was not found written in the book of life, was cast into the pool of fire.

And yes, you are correct that what I quoted as in those terms are in the Gospels, particularly Mathew, but we see those things occurring all over Revelation with the trumpets and bowls. I am confused on what you are saying about "many many years" unapproved mystics. I am referring to 1000 years not being a literal 1000 years as the church teaches us against millennialism.

 

You've raised interesting topics to discuss..
Which could bring in many Scriptural passages and Catholic Magisterium and pertinent articles from the Cath Ency.
I have to go out for a bit.. and shall return
Let me quickly ask.. Chapter 19 in Rev and the Beginnings of Rev Chap 20 appear to me to indicate that a Judgement has taken place - prior to let's say, that "1000 years"//

Check this following out - and, what say you?

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REV CHAPTER 19

↑ 19.

1After this I heard what sounded like the roar of a vast throng in heaven; and they were shouting:

• 
  'Alleluia! Victory and glory and power belong to our God, 2for true and just are his judgements! He has condemned the great whore who corrupted the earth with her fornication, and has avenged upon her the blood of his servants.'

3Then once more they shouted:

• 
  'Alleluia! The smoke goes up from her for ever and ever!'

4And the twenty-four elders and the four living creatures fell down and worshipped God as he sat on the throne, and they too cried:

• 
  'Amen! Alleluia!'

5Then a voice came from the throne which said:

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  'Praise our God, all you his servants, you that fear him, both great and small!'

6Again I heard what sounded like a vast crowd, like the noise of rushing water and deep roars of thunder, and they cried:

• 
  'Alleluia! The Lord our God, sovereign over all, has entered on his reign! 7Exult and shout for joy and do him homage, for the wedding-day of the Lamb has come! His bride has made herself ready,
  8and for her dress she has been given fine linen, clean and shining.'

9Then the angel said to me, 'Write this: "Happy are those who are invited to the wedding-supper of the Lamb!" ' And he added, 'These are the very words of God.' 10At this I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, 'No, not that! I am but a fellow-servant with you and your brothers who bear their testimony to Jesus. It is God you must worship. Those who bear testimony to Jesus are inspired like the prophets.'

11THEN I SAW heaven wide open, and there before me was a white horse; and its rider's name was Faithful and True, for he is just in judgement and just in war. 12His eyes flamed like fire, and on his head were many diadems. Written upon him was a name known to none but himself, 13and he was robed in a garment drenched in blood. Some witnesses read: spattered with blood. He was called the Word of God, 14and the armies of heaven followed him on white horses, clothed in fine linen, clean and shining. 15 From his mouth there went a sharp sword with which to smite the nations; for he it is who shall rule them with an iron rod, and tread the winepress of the wrath and retribution of God the sovereign Lord. 16And on his robe and on his thigh there was written the name: 'King of kings and Lord of lords.'

17Then I saw an angel standing in the sun, and he cried aloud to all the birds flying in mid-heaven: 18'Come and gather for God's great supper, to eat the flesh of kings and commanders and fighting men, the flesh of horses and their riders, the flesh of all men, slave and free, great and small!' 19Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies mustered to do battle with the Rider and his army. 20The beast was taken prisoner, and so was the false prophet who had worked miracles in its presence and deluded those that had received the mark of the beast and worshipped its image. The two of them were thrown alive into the lake of fire with its sulphurous flames. 21The rest were killed by the sword which went out of the Rider's mouth; and all the birds gorged themselves on their flesh.



REV CHAPTER 20

1Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven with the key of the abyss and a great chain in his hands. 2He seized the dragon, that serpent of old, the Devil or Satan, and chained him up for a thousand years; 3he threw him into the abyss, shutting and sealing it over him, so that he might seduce the nations no more till the thousand years were over. After that he must be let loose for a short while.

4Then I saw thrones, and upon them sat those to whom judgement was committed. I could see the souls of those who had been beheaded for the sake of God's word and their testimony to Jesus, those who had not worshipped the beast and its image or received its mark on forehead or hand. These came to life again and reigned with Christ for a thousand years, 5though the rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were over. This is the first resurrection. 6Happy indeed, and one of God's own people, is the man who shares in this first resurrection! Upon such the second death has no claim; but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him for the thousand years.

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The Peace of Jesus be with us

Later, Frankly

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I feel like end of Revelation 19 is referring to the judgement of the beast, the false prophet and his followers. Beginning of 20 could be pointing to those past that have died and even those who died for their belief during tribulation. Where my head begins to hurt is that any images of heaven now or given in the past could be images of the actual end of all time as we know it but being shown to the seers (John in this case) in his real time. What I am trying to describe is that any images of heaven are completely outside of our time and space. There is no time in heaven. It is all past, present and future of humanity all at once. In the timeline of human events though, we do know the antichrist and his followers are overthrown by heaven and that the devil will be bound for "1000 years" then gets a short amount of "time" to be loosed onto humanity once again for a short time.

What I find possibly fascinating about an event like the warning, is that it could be really what protestants might think of as the rapture. Rapturists believe they avoid tribulation because of passages like:

1 Thessalonians 4: [15] For the Lord himself shall come down from heaven with commandment, and with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God: and the dead who are in Christ, shall rise first.

[16] Then we who are alive, who are left, shall be taken up together with them in the clouds to meet Christ, into the air, and so shall we be always with the Lord. [17] Wherefore, comfort ye one another with these words.

Revelation 1: [7] Behold, he cometh with the clouds, and every eye shall see him, and they also that pierced him. And all the tribes of the earth shall bewail themselves because of him. Even so. Amen. [8] I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, saith the Lord God, who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.

Mathew 24: [27] For as lightning cometh out of the east, and appeareth even into the west: so shall the coming of the Son of man be. [28] Wheresoever the body shall be, there shall the eagles also be gathered together. [29] And immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun shall be darkened and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of heaven shall be moved: [30] And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all tribes of the earth mourn: and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with much power and majesty.

I read these as Jesus's coming again comes in 2 stages. First, appearing in the clouds. Protestants think this is rapture of the church, but I feel like it is more like the Warning or what St. Faustina described. We will see Jesus on the cross in the sky and many will run in fear while others will stay with him forever but not be dead, just belong to him. Then, he will come a second time at the end of Revelation where He once again walks on earth and thus his armies destroyed and many are judged and it is the first resurrection as Revelation 20:4 states. Long long after this period, it seems like the devil is free once again for a time (whatever that means) and there will be a final judgement and I assume the end of the earth and all saved humanity lives forever with God in heaven.

So much to ponder and wonder about. I have always enjoyed trying to understand the end times and timelines but it is always just interpretation and discussion because scripture isn't completely clear on these events.

 

This brings to mind LOTR. In the first big battle, the lady cuts off the head of the beast/dragon.

Then later came the final great battle.
This type of pondering never ceases to amaze ~ definitely nothing rigid about it.

 

Did Our Lord Himself not say that only the Father knew the Day of His Return?

Mark 13:32; Matthew 24:36.

No point in us mere men falling out over it!

God bless all here.

 

This following section of Rev 19 occurs before the "1ooo yr" (to be discussed) period

Again I heard what sounded like a vast crowd, like the noise of rushing water and deep roars of thunder, and they cried:

• 
  
  
  • 'Alleluia! The Lord our God, sovereign over all, has entered on his reign!
    Exult and shout for joy and do him homage, for the wedding-day of the Lamb has come!
    His bride has made herself ready, and for her dress she has been given fine linen, clean and shining.'

​

Then the angel said to me, 'Write this: "Happy are those who are invited to the wedding-supper of the Lamb!"

AND IN HEBREWS 2: WE HAVE THIS FOLLOWING​

In Jesus, however, we do see one who for a short while was made lower than the angels, crowned now with glory and honour because he suffered death, so that, by God's gracious will, in tasting death he should stand for us all.

It was clearly fitting that God for whom and through whom all things exist should, in bringing many sons to glory, make the leader who delivers them perfect through sufferings.

For a consecrating priest and those whom he consecrates are all of one stock,
and that is why the Son does not shrink from calling men his brothers,
[ Ps.22.22. ] when he says, 'I will proclaim thy name to my brothers; in full assembly I will sing thy praise';
[ Is.8.17, 2Sm.22.3, Is.8.18. ] and again, 'I will keep my trust fixed on him'; and again, 'Here am I, and the children whom God has given me.'

The children of a family share the same flesh and blood; and so he too shared ours, so that through death he might break the power of him who had death at his command, that is, the devil;
and might liberate those who, through fear of death, had all their lifetime been in servitude.

[ Is.41.8-9. ] It is not angels, mark you, that he takes to himself, but the sons of Abraham. 17And therefore he had to be made like these brothers of his in every way,
so that he might be merciful and faithful as their high priest before God, to expiate the sins of the people.

For since he himself has passed through the test of suffering, he is able to help those who are meeting their test now.

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