Pressure Intensifies on Catholic Church to Change Teaching That Homosexuality Is ‘Intrinsically Diso

Discussion in 'Church Critique' started by sparrow, Apr 25, 2021.

  1. sparrow

    sparrow Exitus ~ Reditus

    Pressure Intensifies on Catholic Church to Change Teaching That Homosexuality Is ‘Intrinsically Disordered’
    According to analysts, the continuing push to remove this phrasing from the Catechism of the Catholic Church is rooted in a broader campaign to legitimize homosexual acts.

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    Bishop Georg Bätzing, president of the German Bishop's Conference in St. Peter's Square on June 27, 2020. (photo: Matthias Kopp)
    Edward Pentin News April 20, 2021
    VATICAN CITY — Pressure continues to be exerted on Church leaders to remove the language of Catholic teaching that states that homosexual acts are “intrinsically disordered” and “under no circumstances can be approved” — pressure that critics believe is part of an effort by some groups and individuals to normalize the sinful behavior within the Church.

    The German bishops, who are in the midst of their two-year Synodal Way that includes a reassessment of the Church’s teaching on sexual morality, are the most recent and visible group pushing to alter the teaching with a particular emphasis on changing the language which appears in the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

    Bishop Georg Bätzing, the president of the German bishops’ conference, said in an interview in December that changes were needed to the Catechism regarding homosexuality and specifically that it should express openness to blessings of homosexual unions — a possibility rejected by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith last month.

    Father Christoph Behrens, a priest of the German Diocese of Dresden, said he believed the Catechism’s language was “simply embarrassing from my pastoral and theological point of view.” The priest, whose bishop, Heinrich Timmerevers, asked him to set up a ministry for homosexuals in his diocese and who advocated same-sex union blessings last September, added: “One can only hope that not too many people read this nonsense.”


    Further calls to change the Catechism’s language have also come from some American Church leaders including Cardinal Joseph Tobin. The archbishop of Newark, New Jersey said in 2019 it the language was “very unfortunate” and added that he hoped the Church would use different words in its discussion of homosexuality that would be “a little less hurtful.”

    For many years discussion has focused on Paragraph 2357 of the Catechism that states: “Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that ‘homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.’ They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.”

    The passage describes homosexual acts, and not the persons themselves, as “intrinsically disordered,” but goes on to state in Paragraph 2358 that homosexual inclination is “objectively disordered” along with other sexual sins (the term “objectively disordered” mysteriously does not appear in Paragraph 2358 of the Catechism published on the Vatican’s website and one has to click on “hide the links to concordance” to see it).

    The motives for removing the language vary with some, especially in Germany, wanting to see a change in the Church’s teaching. These include proponents of the Synodal Path as well as some German ordinaries such as Bishop Peter Kohlgraf of Mainz, Germany. In February, he suggested in February that Catholics with homosexual inclinations cannot all be expected to live chastely and the Church should adopt a pastoral approach that acknowledges this.


    Others are more ambiguous such as Cardinal Christoph Schönborn, secretary of the commission that drafted the Catechism in the 1990s, who has said he considers homosexuality to be similar to other sexual sins, such as divorce and remarriage, and so implicitly not an “intrinsic disorder.” At the 2014 Synod on the Family, he said he saw no reason to change the language at that time but noted “there are developments” in Catholic doctrine.

    Similarly, Jesuit Father James Martin has called on the Church to amend the language with which it discusses homosexuality but has stopped short of publicly calling for a change in Church teaching on the matter. In a discussion in 2017, he said that the phrases “objectively disordered” and “intrinsically disordered” had made homosexual people feel “so subhuman,” and he relayed the story of a mother of a homosexual son who once asked him, “Do they understand what that kind of language can do to a 13-year-old boy? It can destroy him.” As an alternative, Father Martin has suggested the phrase “differently ordered” as he believes it could express the concept “more pastorally.”

    Others believe a case could possibly be made to change the language while remaining totally faithful to the Church’s teaching on the matter. At the 2015 Synod on the Family, Archbishop Charles Chaput, then the metropolitan of Philadelphia, said he understood the desire to find new, more positive language to deal with the issue, adding that the phrase “intrinsically disordered” may have outlived its usefulness. “That language automatically sets people off, and probably isn’t useful anymore,” he said, while adding that any substitute should not obscure the Church’s view that “same-sex attraction is not part of God’s plan.”

    Still others have also argued that the language of “intrinsic disorder” is problematic as they contend that few people, apart from theologians trained in the scholastic tradition, correctly grasp its meaning.

    con't:
     
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  2. sparrow

    sparrow Exitus ~ Reditus

    But Cardinal Willem Eijk, archbishop of Utrecht in the Netherlands, told the Register April 13 that although “one could perhaps try to find a formulation that will be better understood by people nowadays,” he personally saw “no need to modify the present formulation in the Catechism of the Catholic Church with regard the morality of homosexual acts.”

    “One cannot escape making clear that sexual acts between people of the same sex are intrinsically evil, as are all sexual acts which are not marital acts and are not open to the gift of motherhood and fatherhood,” explained Cardinal Eijk, a former physician and a current member of the Pontifical Academy for Life.

    Such acts, he continued, diverge from the “total mutual gift in marriage” and are against nature, that is, “against God’s created order,” and are “essentially intrinsically evil acts.” Furthermore, he added that the Church’s teaching also stems from Holy Scripture; that it is “unchangeable” because it’s been taught through the “whole Tradition of the Church and repeatedly by the magisterium.”

    “It is not an act of charity to withhold the truth on God’s created order and thus on the moral natural law, because this may hinder people in following Christ,” Cardinal Eijk asserted.



    French philosopher Thibaud Collin said he believed it is “important to retain” the current formulation in the catechism as “sexual relations between two people of the same sex cannot be procreative.” He also stressed that homosexual love is “intrinsically contrary to the virtue of chastity,” as Karol Wojtyla explained in his 1960 book Love and Responsibility.

    “It is a passion that in fact instrumentalizes the other as an object of enjoyment by focusing on their sexual value alone,” explained Collin who teaches moral and political philosophy at the Collège Stanislas de Paris.

    “The truth can’t be changed,” said Douglas Farrow, professor of theology and ethics at McGill University in Montreal, Canada, adding that if the Catechism were to be altered in this area, it would only be to “declare the truth more exactly.” Conversely, he said, “it is no act of charity to say that what is, is not; or that what is not, is. That, rather, is to lie.”

    “The only question here is whether this fact — that homosexual acts, like all contraceptive acts, are disordered — should be discreetly hidden from the faithful,” Farrow said. “And what would be the point of that, unless to create room for those who desire to justify such acts to claim that they are not immoral after all, and that it is somehow immoral to say that they are immoral?”



    “The wording is simple, factual, not pejorative or merely rhetorical,” he said. “There would be no pressure to change this wording were it not for the effort to change Catholic moral teaching.”

    German Catholic writer and sociologist Gabriele Kuby, who has written on the dangers of gender ideology and the global sexual revolution, contended that those who wish to adapt the Church’s teaching to an “anything-goes-standard of the pagan world,” use their intellect to “devise clever arguments” to imply there is no “intrinsic evil” — in other words, “no absolute criteria for good and evil.” But if that were true, “there wouldn’t be a single martyr,” she said.

    Both Kuby and Collin drew attention to enormous and relentless pressure on the Church, both in society and within the Church, to change its teaching as it’s the only institution offering well-founded and rationally argued resistance to the global sexual revolution — the “last bulwark,” said Kuby, which is “crumbling” in the West. Bishops and lay organizations in Germany are leading the way in making the Church “compatible with secular paganism,” Kuby said, and called their Synodal Path “clearly heretical and in open opposition to direction from Rome.”

    Collin said that in the Church, the rejection of Humanae Vitae, Pope St. Paul VI’s 1968 encyclical that reaffirmed the Church’s rejection of artificial procreation, is behind the legitimization of homosexuality among many pastors and faithful. “From the moment that procreation and love are disconnected from each other, there is no argument against legitimizing homosexuality,” he explained.



    Collin also gave as a reason for growing acceptance of homosexuality in the Church a “lack of doctrinal formation and/or cowardice” among many clergy and faithful who “no longer understand and respect the moral law,” as well as a “very powerful homosexual lobby in the Church.” Even those who are not part of that lobby are “often unprepared for its demands because they accept the contraceptive mentality,” he said.

    The recent rejection also of St. John Paul II's 1993 encyclical Veritatis Splendor on the moral teaching of the Church has been another confirmation of this, Collin contended, as well as the recent appointment of Msgr. Philippe Bordeyne as president of the John Paul II Pontifical Institute for Marriage and Family Sciences. Msgr. Bordeyne has expressed views dissenting from Humanae Vitae’s teaching on contraception.

    Kuby and Cardinal Eijk both stressed the importance of combining unity of truth and compassion, with Cardinal Eijk explaining that in addition to the call on the Church to “proclaim the truth” through Christ and so shed light on that which is intrinsically evil, the Church also “respects persons as such who fall short in following her teaching and is ready to offer them every pastoral care they need.”

    “The Church has the task, on the one hand, to proclaim the doctrine and, on the other, to be pastorally close to people,” said the cardinal who faced protests for his adherence to Church teaching on homosexuality when he became a bishop in 1999 (“The Catholic Church has an ethical vision that is not always understood in today’s culture,” he said at the time).



    Failure to preach the truth will only cause the Church to become irrelevant, said Kuby, who quoted Matt 5:13 and Christ’s warning of salt losing its savor and making it “no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.”

    “Sadly, so many of our Church leaders don’t seem to get the message of hundreds of thousands turning their back to the Church every year,” Kuby said.

    “Yes,” she added, “the language should be clear like a diamond.”

    Cardinal Schönborn and three Church figures publicly close to the homosexual community and sympathetic to changing the relevant words of the Catechism were contacted for this article but they either did not respond or declined to comment.

    https://www.ncregister.com/news/pre...hat-homosexuality-is-intrinsically-disordered
     
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  3. sparrow

    sparrow Exitus ~ Reditus

    How can this be happening? Our own Bishops, cardinals and priests have absolutely lost the faith! I've known this for years but someone looking at this from outside (or even inside) Catholicism would be so confused by all this nonsense! We know many catholics have no idea anymore about right and wrong, moral and immoral, but this is just so frustrating to watch our One, Holy, Catholic, Apostolic Church being hijacked! :mad:
     
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  4. miker

    miker Powers

    I saw a bit of a similar article today on US Bishops and their perspective on Biden. Like this issue , I think it’s bring out things into the light. Which while hard- is actually imo a good- Christ shines Light on Darkness. Better to see what we are facing. As we all know, like our Lord, the Church must endure its passion to have resurrection. Praying for grace to endure and be the Disciple that I’m called to be


    https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/...e-uneasy-with-biden-but-he-could-be-good-news
     
  5. sparrow

    sparrow Exitus ~ Reditus

    Amen! We certainly are seeing where the weeds are and where the wheat is!
     
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  6. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

    I think that the Germans will create a visible structure of another Church, without dogmas and with a false priesthood, an abolition of desolation on a local scale, although there is already the initial fissure of a schism that started with the publication of the exhortation Amoris Laetitia, I I believe that we have not yet reached the point of having the schism that occurs in the vicinity of the Warning
     
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  7. Carol55

    Carol55 Ave Maria

    Thank you for posting that article Sparrow.

    I just came across the following video which is related to this topic. Alexander Tschugguel speaks about this topic in relation to Austria...

     
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  8. Ananchal

    Ananchal Vigilans

    So question - why when these cardinals and bishops are being interviewed does no one ask them what were the sinful ways as practiced in Sodom and Gomorrah? (n)
     
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  9. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    Sure they would just say lack of charity towards their neighbours.

    They are modernists with a secular outlook on faith.
     
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  10. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

    I see the name of Cardinal Schönborn involved in this and I wonder how the media considered him a spiritual son of Ratzinger in the last conclave, it seems to me that he pretended to be conservative for years because he helped to edit the catechism of St. John Paul II.
     
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  11. DesertStar7

    DesertStar7 Guest

    This will go without saying, but I'll say it anyway:

    I dealt with "Progressive" Protestant clergy and churches from 2008 to 2013.

    At the time I was not politically savvy. Also, I'd just become aware of how highly politicized "Christianity" had gotten compared to my childhood and that Protestant denomination (avoided politics).

    Both the Episcopal and Presbyterian churches (one of each) with whom I dealt claimed to be inclusive, to care, to be accepting, that "all are invited to the Lord's Table" (open Communion).

    And what did I actually find:

    *most can't be bothered to contribute to / attend potlucks
    *most don't want to shake hands and greet during "The Greeting"
    *most can't be bothered to stay even 10 minutes after benediction for half a cup of coffee and one lousy cookie
    *most are right out the door!! and headed for their cars IMMEDIATELY after benediction
    *most politely ignored each other, even in the same pew

    :coffee:

    And how many openly Gay people attended either church at any point in time? NONE.
     
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  12. SeeTheLight

    SeeTheLight New Member

    Please say it isn't so our holy church is taking a beating... 1 Corinthians 6 verses 9-10

    They are supposed to be saving souls and this is not helping.
     
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  13. padraig

    padraig Powers

    The Cure of Ars used to give little talks on the Catechism to children. They were so good adults used to flock from all over France to hear them.

    I was listening to some words of his regarding the Eucharist last night and they were so wonderful and touching that they would make a stone cry. One thing he said which I recall. He said that after Mass people should not rush out to talk to one another; that they should take time to stay in Church to talk to the Eucharistic Lord within.

    I recall one time being in a hurry to get to work after Mass, but at the doorway on the way out my Guardian Angel stopped me and warned me to be careful, that the Good Lord was still present within.

    I think I will listen to his sermons tonight; they are very,very special.

    [​IMG]

     
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  14. DesertStar7

    DesertStar7 Guest

    My point being (my previous post seems incomplete) that the "Progressives" I dealt with did NOT care about others, even Straight and faithfully married, or even disabled.

    So all this clap-trap about "we must be inclusive" ... it's a ruse. Probably for some it's just mindless parroting, but still they do NOT actually care.

    A longtime friend of ours was hospitalized in 2014. She's mildly disabled. The Presbyterian church I've mentioned attending was her church from birth. Her father has served as both Elder and Deacon for decades (on a rotational basis). Her father established a very successful children/teen's program which endured 20 years.

    And yet when M was hospitalized for a week, who all went to visit her?

    NO ONE but husband and me, from that church. :unsure:

    Oh but THEY CARE about _____ people! Baloney. They didn't even care about her.
     
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  15. AidanK

    AidanK A great sinner

    We are reassured that the gates of hell will not prevail,, Our Blessed Lord Himself gave that guarantee when He made Peter the first pope. However, there is no guarantee that the Church cannot be decimated. For years we have had an 'underground ' church of faithful Catholics in China. Perhaps one day all faithful Catholics the world over will be underground while evil is strong.
     
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  16. padraig

    padraig Powers

    It would make a horse cry. I don't want to get into a rant about it , but the Holy Father and the Vatican are standing by simply letting this happen and so are far, far more guilty than these pervert promoting priests.

    They make Martin Luther look like a saint.

    There goes my blood pressure again.:D:D

    Defrock them, excommunicate them. Send the Swiss Gard to shoot them, I don't care; loose them.

    Get tough, Get real, but in the name of the good God and all that's holy, don't, 'Accompany', them, don't try to , 'Reason', with them, don't try to , 'Enter into Dialogue' with them.

    Shoot them, boot them , root them out.

    https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/o...les?utm_source=featured&utm_campaign=standard

    Over 500 German priests vow to defy Church’s ban on same-sex couples
    A much-hyped blessing service for same-sex couples in Germany at more than 50 parishes is being planned for May 10.

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    April 27, 2021 (LifeSiteNews) – Hundreds of priests in Germany have vowed to defy the Vatican’s ban on same-sex blessings. A much-hyped blessing service for same-sex couples titled “Love wins, blessing service for lovers” is planned for May 10 with more than 50 Catholic parishes so far signing up to offer such a blessing.

    Last month, openly homosexual German priest Bernd Mönkebüscher created a Facebook post to protest the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith’s March 15 declaration that the Church cannot bless same-sex relationships since “God does not and cannot bless sin.”

    The Congregation stated that it is “not licit to impart a blessing on relationships, or partnerships, even stable, that involve sexual activity outside of marriage (i.e., outside the indissoluble union of a man and a woman open in itself to the transmission of life), as is the case of the unions between persons of the same sex.”

    Mönkebüscher called the Congregation’s teaching “outdated” in his declaration of protest created with the help of Burkhard Hose.

    “In view of the refusal of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith to bless homosexual partnerships, we raise our voice and say: We will continue to accompany people who commit to a lasting partnership and bless their relationship,” the declaration of protest states.


    SUBSCRIBE to LifeSite's daily headlines
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    “We do not refuse to celebrate a blessing. We do this in our responsibility as pastors who promise people at important moments in their lives the blessing that God alone gives. We respect and appreciate their love and, moreover, believe that God's blessing is with them. Theological arguments and insights have been sufficiently exchanged. We do not accept that an exclusionary and outdated sexual morality is carried out on the backs of people and undermines our work in pastoral care,” the declaration added.

    Mönkebüscher told LifeSiteNews that his declaration has received the support of more than 2,500 individuals, 551 of whom are priests. The declaration has already been sent to the head of the German Bishops' Conference, Bishop Georg Bätzing.

    It is expected that many of the priests who supported the declaration of protest will be giving blessings to same-sex couples on May 10.
     
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  17. Mario

    Mario Powers

    We do not accept that an exclusionary and outdated sexual morality is carried out on the backs of people and undermines our work in pastoral care...

    Indescribably horrific! Unfathomable that these Clergy would join the ranks in the evil one's camp to declare, "We will not serve!" Sweet Jesus, High Priest over the Church, bring a grace of conversion similar to the one granted St. Paul to these rebels, lest they die in the state of mortal sin! Purify our own hearts to better live and share the Gospel!

    Safe in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary!
     
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  18. padraig

    padraig Powers

    Terry I was listening last night to a life of the Cure of Ars. The old saint always looked so careworn and sad from his incredible penances. A scandalous whispering campaign was started that he was worn out be sexual debaucheries, instigated, in the first instance by his fellow priests.

    The exact same thing happened to Padre Pio, again by his fellow clergy. Suggesting he was having sex with women priests in his confession.

    Times change , but times remain the same.

    Evil demonic clergy need jumped on with both feet and exterminated. This is simply not happening.

    Fr James Martin would be the very first on my hit list.

    Instead of which he is idolised by the Vatican.


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    Last edited: Apr 28, 2021
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  19. padraig

    padraig Powers

  20. sparrow

    sparrow Exitus ~ Reditus

    [​IMG]
    Complete Christianity

    The Catholic Blog of Shane Schaetzel

    The Coming Schism and How to Prepare
    April 8, 2021 by Shane Schaetzel
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    The National Catholic Register has been doing an incredible job covering the impending schism in the Catholic Church, and I dare say, they are spearheading the journalistic charge. That’s because those folks at the Register are smart, and they’ve got their ear to the ground on this one. They are now beginning to say what I’ve been saying since the summer of 2018. The Catholic Church is about to undergo a major schism, the likes not seen since the Protestant Revolution and the Eastern Schism combined! This schism may very well become the greatest schism ever, in the history of the Catholic Church. Nothing like it has ever been seen, and I dare say nothing like it will ever be seen again. We have no idea the historical times in which we live, and the major eruption that is about to come.

    It begins in Germany, with the German Bishops Conference and a process they are calling “The Synodal Way.” Basically, what it amounts to is this. A bunch of German bishops are sitting around in conferences, having committees, and sharing their thoughts on things. Their thoughts are basically heretical, and they want major changes in Church doctrine, in everything from the ordination of women to the blessing of same-sex “marriage.” Their methodology is 100% Modernist, and they’ve decided they will go forth with these changes with, or without, Rome’s approval. As for Rome, the Vatican is now backed into a corner, and Pope Francis is at the helm. What to do? Shall the Vatican try to avoid schism through endless “dialogue,” in a vain attempt to get the German bishops to change their mind? Or shall Pope Francis himself intervene and do what all of his predecessors have done in the past — excommunicate the heretics after giving them a limited time to repent? I think we all know what Francis would rather do — endless dialogue. But if he goes down that path, he weakens his own authority, setting the stage for the process of “The Synodal Way” to repeat itself in other nations around the world. Either he acts now, decisively, to contain the schism, or he goes into endless dialogue while watching the schism grow worldwide. Truthfully, I have no idea what Francis will do. Like everyone else, I will just have to watch, wait and see.

    Already, the schism is taking root, and the heresies are metastasizing. Dissenting voices are rising up in Austria and Switzerland. The whole German-speaking Catholic world is preparing for a repeat of the events of the sixteenth century. Next, we’ll see the heresies metastasize into the English-speaking world, just like they did in the sixteenth century. However, things are different now. In the sixteenth century, the English-speaking world consisted of just two islands. Today, it spans three continents! If the German Synodal Way spreads into the English-speaking world, it will span the globe in a very short time. Once it enters the English-speaking world, there will be no stopping it from becoming a global movement, as the Anglosphere spans the globe. From there it will enter the Spanish-speaking world and so on.

    How close are we from it entering the English-speaking world? As an English-speaking American, I can tell you the dissent to orthodoxy is already present, active and it’s been here for a while. However, the schismatic language has not yet materialized in the Anglosphere. Just give it time, however, because the underlying attitude is very present and ready to go. If Francis is slow at nipping the German schism in the bud, their cancer will spread into the Anglosphere very quickly. When it does, all hope is lost. The schism will go global overnight. The United Kingdom, Ireland, the United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand will all find themselves in the throes of a schismatic struggle between orthodoxy and heresy. It will happen faster than anyone can imagine, because the soil has been primed for it for decades. Dioceses will pull away from Rome, one at a time, and parishes within dioceses will pull away from their bishops, one after another. The soil in the Anglosphere is so fertile for schism, I can’t even muster the words to describe it. It only requires the right circumstances to move forward. A breakaway Catholic Church in Germany, with a pope in the Vatican who does nothing about it, will be more than enough to start the process in the Anglosphere. ...
     
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