Pope Francis meets Russian Orthodox Metropolitan Hilarion days after split with Greek Orthodox Churc

Discussion in 'GARABANDAL LIBRARY' started by non sum dignus, Oct 31, 2018.

  1. Pope Francis met with Metropolitan Hilarion just days after the Russian Orthodox Patriarchate of Moscow cut ties with the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople, Bartholomew I, claiming his recognition of an independent Orthodox Church in Ukraine departed from Orthodox Christian norms.
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2018
  2. Don_D

    Don_D ¡Viva Cristo Rey!

    I think he will go to Russia soon. The situation in the Orthodox Church is dire.

    Constantinople's decision on Ukraine part of global plan to destroy Russian Church - Patriarch Kirill
    Moscow, October 30, Interfax - Patriarch Kirill of Moscow and All Russia says the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople's decisions on Ukraine are part of a global order to destroy the "island of freedom," as he described the Russian Orthodox Church.

    "The stakes are very high, and the order to destroy the unity of our Church is an order that has a global dimension. This is not just a fight for jurisdiction, this is a fight to destroy the only powerful Orthodox force in the world. When we're talking about 150 million [Orthodox believers], this is truly so," Patriarch Kirill said at a meeting with participants in the Faith and Word festival in Moscow on Tuesday.

    "Certainly, someone had to deal a blow to this island of freedom. Why do I call Orthodoxy an island of freedom? Because we are free from global brainwashing and the dominance of someone else's thoughts over us," he said.

    "The tragedy of Ukraine goes beyond the boundaries of politics and has a mystical dimension," the patriarch said.

    He also discussed details of the preparations for his closed meeting with Patriarch Bartholomew in Istanbul on August 31, which he said was the last attempt to settle the conflict with Constantinople over Ukraine diplomatically.

    Patriarch Kirill said he proposed to Constantinople that Bartholomew and he meet on neutral territory, such as the Swiss town of Chambesy, but the latter insisted on meeting at his seat in Istanbul. The patriarch said some in Moscow tried to talk him out of the visit as being too humiliating.

    "I realized that this was [Constantinople's] desire to cut us down to size. But this is [only] humiliating to those who pay attention to such trifles. I am ready to walk anywhere, if only I can prevent the developments that we are having today," he said.

    Patriarch Bartholomew's position on Ukraine was "quite harsh and radical" at this meeting, he said.

    On October 11, the Synod of the Ecumenical Patriarchate abrogated the ordinance of 1686 that put the Kiev Metropolitanate under the jurisdiction of the Moscow Patriarchate, announced the opening of a mission in Kiev, and rehabilitated the leaders of the unrecognized Ukrainian Orthodox churches. In response, the Synod of the Moscow Patriarchate fully severed its relations with the Constantinople Patriarchate.
  3. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    The plot thickens.......
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  4. SteveD

    SteveD Powers

    From 'Forbes' (a piece which is similar to many others following Kirill's installation).
    "The installation of Kirill I as the new patriarch of the Russian Orthodox Church last month will not end the subordination of the church to the Putin regime. On the contrary, the church is likely to emerge as an even stronger supporter of dictatorship and anti-Western ideology.

    Kirill, who was the Metropolitan of Smolensk, succeeds Alexei II who died in December after 18 years as head of the Russian Church. According to material from the Soviet archives, Kirill was a KGB agent (as was Alexei). This means he was more than just an informer, of whom there were millions in the Soviet Union. He was an active officer of the organization. Neither Kirill nor Alexei ever acknowledged or apologized for their ties with the security agencies."

    He is also believed to be a billionaire, like Putin. He was shown in a video wearing a watch worth several thousand dollars. The watch 'disappeared' from his wrist but they forgot to photoshop the reflection on the polished table! Kirill and Putin see Russian Orthodoxy as a means of exercising authority outside their borders and so the fuss about the Ukraine. They also crave leadership of the whole of Orthodoxy. It's China all over again, wait for Francis to sacrifice the Catholic Uniate Churches who are detested by the ROC.

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  5. Ezdras

    Ezdras Guest

    Pope Francis did the right thing in this case. The Constantinople patriarch (a Turkish citizen under Turkish jurisdiction as a rule) did a gross violation of established principles in the Orthodox world. One cannot secede fold of another Church and to go unpunished. Practically Bartolomew is excommunicated now. I don't know if there will be other Orthodox Churches to stand behind Bartolomew...

    Let also notice that the Constantinople patriarch is not a leader of all Orthodox Christians, he is Not similar to the Pope in the Roman Catholic Church. The Orthodox principle is Apostolic and Synodal. The Russian Orthodox Church leads its Apostolic succession from St Andrew the Apostle and is independent Church. It doesn't receive orders from abroad, not by another orthodox patriarch when it has it's own.

    The crisis in the Catholic Church shows the need of United efforts and not further separations.
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 31, 2018
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  6. Malachi Martin's interview in 1996 regarding the 3rd secret of Fatima, Kiev (the Ukraine) and Russia...

    The current situation might explain why Malachi Martin said that Kiev and Russia were part and parcel to the fulfillment of our Lady's plan at Fatima.
    He said as to why Kiev and Russia, he could not reveal because it was a Papal secret.
    Malachi Martin said he had read the 3rd secret. He swore an oath not to reveal the exact wording or content.

    So now we see a very likely reason why the Pope might go to Russia, setting off the events foretold in Garabandal.
    The Pope goes to Russia, shortly after this tensions break out, Russia suddenly overruns much of the world (Communism returns), when things are at their worst the great warning takes place.


    Mrs. [Christine] Bocabeille then asked Mari Loli: "If you are not allowed to tell me the exact year [of the Warning], perhaps you could tell me approximately when it will happen."
    "Yes, it will be at that time when the world will most need it."
    "When is that?"
    "When Russia will unexpectedly and suddenly overrun and overwhelm a great part of the free world. God does not want this to happen so quickly. In any case the Warning will come when you will see that Holy Mass cannot be celebrated freely anymore; then it will be that the world will most need the intervention of God."
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  7. Don_D

    Don_D ¡Viva Cristo Rey!

    I don't doubt that Kirill has ties to the Russian intelligence agencies, however, when I heard both he and Putin a few years ago begin to speak saying things like this it was impossible to ignore them. They are speaking the unvarnished truth about our times and defending the Faith.

    jerry and sunburst like this.
  8. padraig

    padraig Powers

    I feel sorry for the poor Russians, they won;t let them vist Mount Athos anymore; I adore Mt Athos. But perhaps this schism they are having will turn them more to the One True Church.

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  9. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

    do the Orthodox consider this schism a sign of the end of time, just as we Catholics consider the apostasy that has been occurring in the Church since Francis became Pope?
  10. padraig

    padraig Powers

    I have just no idea whatsover.

    But what a great, great question!!

    I would specualete that they in the East..as we in the West as some huge saints alive at the moment..as we always do....that those siants in the East, endowed with the powers of Prophesy have some understanidning of what is happening..

    ..but to a large extent becuase they are Schismatics they are blinded to see the future...
    ntI know this is not fashionble to call them this...but they are Schismatics...and so Prophetically blind to a large extet.. blind
    Fatima, Luan Ribeiro and Byron like this.
  11. Patriarch Kirill appeals to Pope, UN over Ukraine Church
    She Went in Haste to the Mountain (Page 190)

    And she talked to him about the Miracle, and explained in what it was going to consist. Later Conchita wrote it down briefly on the back of a holy card of the Child Jesus, which Serafín keeps concealed and which none of the family has seen. And she told him that it would occur when a definite event in the Church took place, and she also explained it to him. Only in this way does Serafín know the date of the miracle.

    Later Serafín and I discussed the following excerpt from a leaflet written by Dr. Puncernau:

    «During one of my trips to the pastures, I was alone with Serafín and we were eating in the barn. After eating, I tried to draw him out since it was said that he knew from Conchita when the Warning would be.

    I drew the conclusion that if he knew, he didn't want to say. The only thing that I got definitely from him was that it would be preceded by a special happening in the Church. After many questions and answers, it seemed clear to me from his
    vague remarks that it would be something like a schism. That is the way I understood it

    Could the schism possibly be the one in the Orthodox Church?
    A schism that prompts the Pope to go to Moscow to mediate?
    When he returns tensions break out, Russia over-runs part of the world, then the warning...
    gracia, Carol55, djmoforegon and 3 others like this.
  12. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    Malachy Martin mentioned Kiev, Ukraine & Russia with regards to the 3rd secret of Fatima -- that salvation would come from the east.
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  13. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

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  14. Don_D

    Don_D ¡Viva Cristo Rey!

    This would seem to fit our times very well. It is very sad to see that instead of reuniting the Church in the East continues to divide and can not work out it's problems. It seems to me that the time for Pope Francis to go to Moscow is long past however. What perilous times we live in. Prayers and Mass today for Pope Francis and for the mending of the Church.
    Agnes rose, gracia and Mary's child like this.
  15. Mary's child

    Mary's child Powers

    Yes I agree.
    gracia likes this.
  16. Carol55

    Carol55 Ave Maria

    Church Council elects the leader of the unified Orthodox Church in Ukraine
    December 16, 2018.

    On December 15 the Church Unification Council took place in Kyiv. The Council, or Sobor in Ukrainian, chose the head of the new single Orthodox Church in Ukraine. It is Metropolitan of Pereyaslav-Khmelnytskyi and Bila Tserkva Epiphanius. On January 6, 2019 the leader of the newly established church together with the Ukrainian President will fly to Istanbul where Patriarch Bartholomew will hand him the Tomos of autocephaly and so the procedure of getting the church independence will be completed. UCMC reviewed Ukrainian media to collect the key facts explaining the events.

    Who was present at the Church Unification Council? The delegates of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the Kyiv Patriarchate (UOC KP) included 42 bishops, each one with a priest and a member of laity, making for a total of 126 delegates. Ten bishops of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the Moscow Patriarchate (UOC MP) confirmed participation, similarly coming with a priest and a laity member each. They sent 30 delegates in total. The rest of the delegates were representatives of the Ukrainian Autocephalous Church. Prior to the Council the exarchs of the Ecumenical Patriarchate said Sobor would be attended by 64 bishops, 64 priests and 64 laity members. The President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko and the Head of the Verkhovna Rada (Ukraine’s Parliament) Andriy Parubiy attended Sobor.

    What was the voting procedure? Each Ukrainian hierarch regardless of the church he represents had a possibility of taking to Sobor two more persons with the right to vote. Each participant could suggest a candidate to the post of the church head but his own. The votes were cast secretly. Everyone voted – including the hierarchs, the laity members, clergy and monks, then three main candidates were chosen. Those three candidates were included into the ballot, and it was just the bishops choosing the church head out of the three finalists.

    Who is Metropolitan Epiphanius? Metropolitan Epiphanius, the leader of the new unified Orthodox Church, has been Patriarch Filaret’s right hand man at the church directorate of the UOC KP for the last five years. By the church standards he is young – 39 years old. His name at birth is Serhiy Dumenko, he was born in the village of Vovkove, in Odesa region, to a family of workers. He studied at the Kyiv Theological Seminary and at the Kyiv Theological Academy. Epiphanius also studied philosophy at the Athens National University. Having completed his studies in Greece Epiphanius received tonsure at the Mykhailivskyi Golden-Domed Monastery. He engaged in the administrative side of life at the Ukrainian Orthodox Church in 2008. In 2017 Patriarch Filaret appointed Epiphanius the Metropolitan of Pereyaslav-Khmelnytskyi and Bila Tserkva. He is also a member of the National Journalists’ Union of Ukraine and of the International Federation of Journalists. Metropolitan Epiphanius is also the rector of the Kyiv Theological Academy.

    What are his advantages?

    Despite his young age Metropolitan Epiphanius made a quick church career and worked as Filaret’s deputy for five years. In contrast to the many Ukrainian colleagues of his who studied in Russia, the future leader of the single church was educated in Ukraine and in Greece. “The advantage Epiphanius has is that he knows well the administrative component of the church development,” explains religious studies expert Yuriy Chornomorets. “Besides, the Metropolitan has a moderate temper and knows Greek language. In theory he will be able to directly negotiate with the Ecumenical Patriarch,” the expert adds.

    Epiphanius is being identified as a person standing far from the main groups of influence within the church and at the same time close to Patriarch Filaret. On the other hand the Ecumenical Patriarchate may perceive Epiphanius as Filaret’s “shadow”, the one who informally “continues his line”, that may possibly be not much appreciated by Constantinople.

    Epiphanius on the Russian Church. Certain conclusions on Epiphanius’s mindset can be made based on his article of December 2015 named “How long will the hand of Moscow be digging deep into Ukrainian souls?” In the article Epiphanius was describing anti-Ukrainian “joint actions of the Moscow Patriarchate leadership and Russia’s political leadership involving representatives of the actual clergy of the Moscow Patriarchate Church in Ukraine.”

    In his article he further emphasizes that the Russian authorities have been implementing the politics of “completely involving the units of the Moscow Patriarchate in Russia and abroad to implement its own domestic and foreign policy.” Epiphanius emphasized a huge impact of the Russian secret services on the Orthodox Church, he also said it includes special agents within its clergy.

    First statements after the Unification Council.“We have managed to unite the three branches of Ukrainian Orthodoxy into a single national Orthodox Church. The doors of our church are open for everyone,” Epiphanius stated after the Council ended speaking at the Sophiyska square in Kyiv in the evening of December 15. He thanked Constantinople, the President of Ukraine and Head of the UOC KP Patriarch Filaret, Head of the Ukrainian Autocephalous Church Makariy, all the hierarchs as well as Ukraine’s Parliament for the unity they demonstrated.

    Epiphanius was presented by President Poroshenko. On the square there were people waiting for the new church leader to be presented for about 10 hours. Summarizing Sobor Poroshenko said: “This day will or has already become part of history as a holy day, the day when the autocephalous national Orthodox Church was established. It is the day of us getting the ultimate independence from Russia. Ukraine will no longer be drinking Moscow’s poison from the Moscow’s cup,” the President said.

    Despite his presence at the Unification Council President Poroshenko said the state will not be interfering into the church life: “Neither had we had the state church, nor will we have one,” Poroshenko reassured.


    https://twitter.com/KatyaYushchenko (The above was retweeted on Catholic News Service (@CatholicNewsSvc) and KY's twitter feed is very interesting if you are interested in Ukraine and/or Russia.)
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2018
  17. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    Outside Kiev’s St Sophia Cathedral, thousands have gathered to pray and wait for the decision of the Unification Council of Ukrainian Churches on the future of the Unified Ukrainian Orthodox Church.

    With regard to the 3rd secret of Fatima why would Malachi Martin mention Ukraine, why Kiev? One can understand Russia/Moscow as our Lady requested that Russia be consecrated to her Immaculate Heart.

    Could it be that these places are all mentioned in the 3rd secret?

    We are definitely getting closer and closer to the prophecies indicating a world wide warning -- civil unrest has begin in France and begun to spill into neighbouring countries. Uncertainties over Brexit - potential economic crash in Europe that would lead to chaos -- and in the Church chaos -- Cardinal vs Cardinal

    Time to increase our prayers!
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  18. Carol55

    Carol55 Ave Maria

    g., Yes, exactly and there are multiple ways to invade a country.

    France to Probe Possible Russian Influence on Yellow Vest Riots
    By Carol Matlack and Robert Williams | https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...edia-takes-aim-at-macron-as-yellow-vests-rage
    ‎December‎ ‎07‎, ‎2018‎ ‎11‎:‎00‎ ‎PM Updated on ‎December‎ ‎09‎, ‎2018‎ ‎9‎:‎23‎ ‎AM
    • Security services to look into social media, minister says
    • Russian-linked sites increase targeting of French protests
    A demonstrator kicks a smoke grenade shot by riot police during a demonstration by high school students in Lyon, on Dec. 7.

    Photographer: Jean-Philippe Ksiazek/AFP via Getty Images

    France opened a probe into possible Russian interference behind the country’s Yellow Vest protests, after reports that social-media accounts linked to Moscow have increasingly targeted the movement.

    According to the Alliance for Securing Democracy, about 600 Twitter accounts known to promote Kremlin views have begun focusing on France, boosting their use of the hashtag #giletsjaunes, the French name for the Yellow Vest movement. French security services are looking at the situation, Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian said Sunday in a radio interview with RTL.

    Russia has been criticized for using social media to influence elections in the U.S. and elsewhere. Attempts to use fake news reports and cyberattacks to undercut the 2017 campaign of French President Emmanuel Macron failed, but Russian-linked sites have pushed questionable reports of a mutiny among police, and of officers’ support for the protests.

    “An investigation is now underway,” Le Drian said. “I will not make comments before the investigation has brought conclusions.”

    The Twitter accounts monitored by the alliance usually feature U.S. or British news. But the French protests “have been at or near the top” of their activity for at least a week, according to Bret Schafer, the alliance’s Washington-based social media analyst. “That’s a pretty strong indication that there is interest in amplifying the conflict” for audiences outside France.

    The Alliance for Securing Democracy is a unit of the German Marshall Fund of the U.S., which monitors pro-Kremlin activity.

    The assertion of police dissatisfaction -- which doesn’t appear to be supported by facts -- resembles other Kremlin-backed disinformation campaigns that have tried to engender mistrust in Western governments and show that liberal democracies are in decline, Schafer says.

    Russian State Media

    Much of the tweeted material comes from Russian state media outlets including the Sputnik news website, the RT television network, and Ruptly, a German-based video news agency that belongs to RT. These outlets are covering the French crisis closely; RT has said that 12 of its journalists have been injured in the protests, far more than any other news organization.

    Sputnik and RT have reported in recent days that most French police no longer support Macron and are siding with the protesters. Their sources: representatives of two small police unions that together won less than 4 percent of votes in nationwide union elections this month. Sputnik and RT also have shown a video – widely shared on French social media -- of police in the southwestern town of Pau removing their helmets in what was described as a sign of solidarity with protesters. Local police and journalists on the scene said the description was untrue. They said some officers had briefly removed their helmets to talk with protesters before putting them back on.

    In response to questions from Bloomberg News, Sputnik later corrected its article about police in Pau showing solidarity with protesters, to say the report "hasn’t been backed by evidence so far." RT said its article about police siding with protesters, based on comments by the head of a minor police union, was justified because he had been quoted by other news outlets.

    Read here for more on why people in yellow vests are blocking roads

    Macron complained repeatedly during his 2017 campaign that Kremlin-controlled media outlets were spreading fake news about him, because he took a tougher stance on Russia than his chief rivals, Marine Le Pen of the far-right National Front and François Fillon of the conservative Republicans. But negative stories, such as a Sputnik report claiming Macron lived a “double life” and was backed by a “wealthy gay lobby,” never gained traction.

    In one instance, a bogus website resembling the site of a Belgian newspaper reported that Macron’s campaign was being bankrolled by Saudi Arabia. The source of the hoax was never determined, but the European Union’s East Stratcom Task Force, which tracks Russian disinformation efforts, said it bore striking similarities to an earlier incident traced to a Russian “troll factory.”

    Separately, the Macron campaign was hit with repeated email phishing attacks resembling those used by Russia against Democratic Party organizations in the U.S. The Kremlin said it had no involvement in any fake news or cyberattacks on Macron, describing such accusations as “slander.”

    — With assistance by Nate Lanxon, and Helene Fouquet
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  19. Don_D

    Don_D ¡Viva Cristo Rey!

    Yes, specifically Russia and Kiev by name which looking back tells me that if Father Martin knew this then the Popes have known this also and Pope Francis certainly knows it as well. Something huge rests on this lynch pin of Ukraine and Russia specifically with the Church.
    Agnes rose likes this.
  20. Don_D

    Don_D ¡Viva Cristo Rey!

    Last edited: Dec 17, 2018

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