Discussion in 'The Signs of the Times' started by Franciscan, May 5, 2020.
I am keeping your daughter's recovery in my prayers, Byron.
Byron, that is so frightening! I pray that God gives your daughter the mighty protection of a second guardian angel with boxing gloves on.
Byron, how awful, joining the prayers for your dear daughter.
Our son lives in Brooklyn and is furloughed right now from his two jobs. Since Covid, I sent him a small crucifix to put over the door of his apartment. He’s told me, “not going to put it up. “ I am sad, I’ll keep praying.
I’m sorry Byron,
I can’t see the post about your daughter... praying she is ok. I have a loved one there as well and I pray constantly that they leave NY! Lord willing!
I’ll pray, too
No, I have no problem and neither would God's messengers, so long as they don't despise his prophets. So what is despise? To slander the messenger and/or their alleged message, because of what one cannot discern that is not contrary to scripture or Church teachings. I believe God allows for this kind of discernment and will respect a bishop, priest or lay person who would do as much. One should not cast stones towards them, as is seen often on this forum by a few. This is what is "dangerous" to a soul who believes in God. Being a bishop or any clergy for that matter does not mean they have the gift of prophetic discernment and they should follow just like any of us what I have said about discernment. I don't believe his bishop slandered Father Michel, he just simply acknowledged that he does not believe in "chastisements" (apparently, even given by approved apparitions such as Akita and others, as he did not qualify) the "Warning" (as even approved saints and messengers have revealed), "War" (as approved prophets have said), the "Era of Peace" (as our Lady of Fatima approved prophecy and Revelations 20 speaks to). Rejecting the few I have mentioned that are approved by the Church and then the bishop rejecting this in what Father Michel has said seems poor prudence and discernment by any standard. It tells me Father Michel's bishop has very bad prophetic discernment. It does not make him a sinner, but discernment is a spiritual gift and he is not the only clerical to have bad discernment in these matters.
"Do not despise prophecies, but test everything; hold fast what is good." We can't talk about "despise," without also "test." No partial quotes!
"Being a bishop or any clergy for that matter does not mean they have the gift of prophetic discernment." BUT, if they are acting in the Name of the Church, as part of a role (bishop) or appointment (expert theologian), THEY DO have authority to make judgments on "prophets."
"I don't believe his bishop slandered Father Michel..." No, the bishop DID NOT slander. He reported on what he knows.
"he just simply acknowledged that he does not believe in "chastisements..." AND YOU, YOU KNOW what the bishop believes, exactly? Maybe, the bishop believes Fr. Michel's ideas, of "Chastisements" and "The Warning," are different from the Church. Fr. Michel, maybe, is "over his skis."
"Rejecting the few I have mentioned that are approved by the Church and then the bishop rejecting this in what Father Michel has said seems poor prudence and discernment by any standard..." "It tells me Father Michel's bishop has very bad prophetic discernment. It does not make him a sinner, but discernment is a spiritual gift and he is not the only clerical to have bad discernment in these matters..."
Fatima, you do not have the bishop's training, his "charism" given by ordination and his consecration as bishop, or his authority! Don't you worry you may be slandering the bishop?
Yes, Byron I will add your daughter to my intentions for safety.
Did the children of Fatima have the "charism" of their bishop and priest? Yet they were the ones to receive what God wanted revealed prior to any bishops or priests approval. They were mocked by the majority of people, yet they believed in what our Lady was saying to them the whole time. So many other saints did as well. You seem to think the ordained have charism/prophetic discernment, because of their ordination, while the laity are considered of lesser discernment and charism. Tell this to the many approved messengers throughout Christian history who were children, women and men of no importance to the world, of no priestly ordination, whom God chose to reveal his plans to. Jesus made real clear it is those with child like faith that are cherished by God whom he would speak to. God has always acted and shared his plans to the simple of heart, often times young children and humble souls, like young Michel and now Abbot Michel. If the discernment of the clergy in general today is where God is working, we would not be in the pickle we are today within the Church and loosing most of the baptized to the world. God would not need to speak to the children and simple folk if the majority "learned" of clergy in general were teaching and practicing the faith. It is the humble of heart that God has chosen to speak his prophecies to, today, as always. No, I am not worried about slandering the bishop, as I have not said anything untrue or uncharitable about him. One can argue the why's and why not's, but it is true many clergy have had their minds and hearts changed only after prophetic events unfolded and it will be no different this time.
What a beautiful child-like faith this holy priest has. I am starting to believe him. I did believe in Fr Gobbi also and well, we all know the rest of the story. His joy in the faith is simply exhilarating. One can only pray we will get a pope like that.
No, this is not the criteria on slander - which is a serious accusation. If you are making that judgement please back it up with evidence. And who is “casting stones”? You owe those people, which you conveniently do not name, an apology.
What?! 70,000 people showed up for the miracle that October, a majority of people certainly didn’t mock them. And in any case, what does Fatima have to do with the good Father? The fact that father has been caught not being honest in telling his bishop everything makes it seem more like Bayside, etc. This is what you, and folks like you, fail to discern. You open yourself up to deception by default instead of using the Church’s norms for discernment.
The rest of the story, with regard to his “prophecies”, is that he unfortunately missed on almost every single one - if not every single one. Not exactly someone to aspire to be like when it comes to prophecy - apparent good will and personal holiness aside.
Not to jump in,but I believe that picadillo was referring to Padre Pio's story. Please do not blur the comments as it distorts. Have a blessed day.
As for "casting stones," I remember, you said a member of this forum, personally, was like the people who mocked St. Bernadette at Lourdes, as she dug into the soil. All the "naysayers" language! "Naysayers" will drown outside the ark. They will suffer, this or that, but "believers," like you, will not.
Yes, bishops and priests have training you do not have, and "gifts of the Holy Spirit," you do not. From catholic.org, it explains. Bishops get "two doses" of the Spirit, through two different blessings/consecrations,
Holy orders is administered by the laying on of hands and the key phrases of the ordination preface. Only a Bishop can validly ordain. Order is a purely ecclesiastical concern. The effect of the sacrament of order is to impart the Holy Spirit and to impress an indelible character, which permanently distinguishes those in orders from the laity.
The Fatima children, they did not need the "gift of discernment." They only had to simply repeat, what they were told. The bishop had the God-given job, to "discern" and to judge/proclaim. The Blessed Mother made that job easy, with the Sun! But the children, they had no right to declare, "worthy of belief."
Yes, many priests/bishops ignore "prophecy," these days. But, most "prophets" are not from God, there are many, many, many people who say, they have messages, but sadly, do not.
Marie Julie Jahenny saw that there would be many, many false prophets and prophecies in future times.
The door is NOT wide open for acceptance of alleged prophecies in the Church. Everything we do or think or say or read has a spiritual consequence.
I can’t see Our Lord leaving us out of the ark because we don’t follow unapproved prophecy. But I can definitely see that I have been duped by a false and condemned apparition movement in the past and it has affected my life in ways you can’t imagine. Think about people who have given away their money or in my case, put their life on hold. And the thing is, even if one bit is true and the rest turns out to be false, people are still going to be hurt by it. It’s irresponsible.
"Even the elect would be deceived"
I am always mindful of this warning. Always.
..if that were possible.
Hi Mary’s child. If you go back and read the post, he was speaking of Fr. Gobbi, not Padre Pio. You have a blessed day as well.
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