Malachi Martin called it "the end of these Catholic times"--not end times. I don't know if Glenn would call that a good translation or not.
Why is Medjugorje "credible" and Garabandal not ? ( BTW no other apparition has the amount of saints and popes behind it ). Go ahead explain please.
That is true, an unusual phrase, but since Conchita was able to specify exactly when this period of anticipation would end (the death of the 4th Pope, Benedict) I'm not too concerned. In addition, the events to follow help with the timetable leading up to the Warning- resurgence of communism, a Pope visits Moscow, an important synod, Russia invades Europe. Once the Warning occurs, the Miracle happens within 4 months ( 2nd Thursday of April in an even year). Another point to remember is that Conchita shared the year of the Miracle with Pope Paul VI; I assume one reason that the Vatican has not condemned Garabandal is because the April of that year has yet to arrive (Conchita is currently 74 years old, according to Glenn). Safe Under Mary's Mantle!
I know and believe that garabandal apparition is authentic, but my question is the term often used 'end of times'. Who started using it? nowhere in her approved (or authentic) apparitions our lady used this term. Many of my friends here in lebanon argue with me about this term saying that this is misleading.
The end of THE times was referred at Garabandal BECAUSE people refused to heed Mary's advice at Fatima! It didn't need to be said prior to Garabandal. Notice how the 3rd secret was not released in 1960, but Mary appears in Garabandal in 1961, that was not an accident, she was upset people weren't listening to her warning. Also you and your friends ought to wake up to the fact that Garabandal has more Saints and Popes as supporters than any other apparition in history ! Saint ( Padre ) Pio Saint (Pope) John Paul II Saint (Pope ) Paul VI Saint (Mother) Teresa of Calcutta Saint (Fr. ) Jose Maria Escriva Saint (Madre) Maravillas Pope Benedict XVI Don't tell me its not authentic !
Wow Glenn as we would say in Belfast "wind your neck in" I get your passion and I imagine your workload is massive when it comes to Garabandal but the guy was only asking a question and looking for direction
I find Garabandal to be quite credible, more so now than in the past. I’m one of a minority here on MOG who do not give Medjugorge any credibility whatsoever. The more traditional minded a Catholic, the less credible Medjugorge seems, in my experience.
It's not the question, its the insult that didn't need to be included in the question. Disrespect deserves no respect.
Have you ever been to Medjugorge Brian ?? I get the apprehension.. for me and my intelligence I cant seem to understand how anywhere that has powerful devotion and prayer to Our Holy Mother can be negative at all.
I go back and forth. I get where Brian is coming from. But just recently Sr Briege McKenna gave a very moving and persuasive account of her experiences there. I just listened to it. And Fr James Blount SOLT who I respect very much is absolutely certain of it. It has certainly produced vocations. Look at Fr Calloway. I don't know. Other priests that I have great respect for say it is grand deception.(Fr John Hardin SJ) I guess it won't be long before we know one way or the other.
I find this argument specious, that one must visit there to discern its merits. I know there’s war in Ukraine without visiting. I know there are true messages at Fatima without visiting. I’ve seen it repeatedly. That and “You can’t deny it’s fruits!” That’s not how the Church judges supposed apparitions. Obedience, humility and orthodoxy accompany true Marian apparitions. I’ve done enough research about the early history and the supposed early apparitions, as well as the immoral behavior of their Franciscan priest manipulators and their subsequent defrocking and even excommunication to know to avoid it. “It was these dissident Franciscans who nurtured and promoted the Medjugorje cult from the very beginning. Among them were Tomislav Vlasic, Jozo Zovko (the priest to whom the seers first brought their story, known to be a charismatic and an Ustaša sympathizer), Ivica Vego and Ivan Prusina. All four would be eventually suspended and laicized.” These are not the fruits of a true apparition. Therefore no, I have not, and will not, visit.
Well that's probably the worst problem sorted, no excuses now, surely there are plenty of busses I can hijack for a few days.
Hi zouxi. The phrase "the end of times" is the same as the "end of the age" or the "consummation of the age." . The Greek phrase συντέλεια αἰῶνός is made of up two words: synteleia [completion, consummation, end, culmination] https://biblehub.com/greek/4930.htm aionos [era, time, epoch] https://biblehub.com/greek/165.htm Here is how the word synteleia [translated as "end" or "consummation"] is described on that Strong's page: 4930 /syntéleia ("culminating end, finish") is not strictly "termination" but rather "consummation" (completion) that ushers in a new time-era/age (Mt 13:39,40,49,24:3, 28:20). As you can see from the locations where the phrase is used in Matthew, it is talking about the end of one epoch, which then opens into a new epoch. Specifically, it will be the end of the "Era of the Church Militant" and the beginning of the "Era of Peace." This transitional period between these two epochs is described as "the Church's ultimate trial," in the Catechism of the Catholic Church sections 675-677. Garabandal is a legitimate private revelation. As such, it is not revealing anything different from that which is already contained within public revelation. The Parable of the Wheat and the Tares (Matthew 13) and the Olivet Discourse (Matthew 24) deal with the subject matter relevant to "the end of times."
If only some of those supporters were popes, then we wouldn’t still be waiting for official approval I’m firmly in the camp that these are obviously not authentic. From supposed incorruptible bodies being found corrupt, to no new eyes after all, to now the end of times thing, etc. But I also don’t think it’s extremely harmful like some of the others that floated around here. But I don’t think that poor poster deserved that treatment. He was just stating his opinion on a message board.
Regarding Garabandal ( which I do believe in) and Medjugorje , I’ve read extensively…over many decades, on both. And while I know a very traditional priest and now passed on, very old school nun who believe/believed in Garabandal fully and met Concheta , the priest does not believe in the apparitions at Medjugorje. When asked why, he stated that another priest he knew visited there, and when he and others found themselves having a conversation with one of the male seers ( name escapes me), one of the priests asked the seer ( paraphrasing) “ Aren’t we approaching the time when Mary appears to you?” His reply was, “She will wait”. Now did that actually happen? Is that enough to make one go from believing in the validity of the apparitions to not believing? I don’t know. I heard it thirdhand. All I know is, nothing I read in many books, articles and interview’s dissuades me from believing. And so I read the messages and follow any developments with prudence. I will add that in 1989, I told many friends in college that as much as I’d love to visit Medjugorje, I’d only go if it was somehow miraculously free, because Id never ask my parents or anyone else for the money. There was a raffle for a free ticket to go that Easter. I never bothered buying a ticket. Unknown to me, a dear, much older friend did. She was the campus switchboard operator we all knew and loved. They had her draw the winning ticket out of a box in a packed cafeteria and, just before she did and because she and I were well known to joke with eachother I yelled out “ It’s rigged”, and we all started chuckling. She pulled out a ticket, and it was my name. Another man, a Brother, handed me spending money for the trip later on. And so, I went to Medjugorje without spending a cent of my parents money, or having to ask anyone for money. However, it was a double edged sword. Several circumstances got me to go to out of state college, because I’ve suffered from a type of agoraphobia/severe homesickness my whole life and would never have gone otherwise. As our departure to Medjugorje approached, my agoraphobia/severe homesickness began kicking in. I felt too embarrassed to back out. Those first nights in Medjugorje, on the other side of the globe and being inconsolably homesick, were so potently a nightmare for me that even typing about them brings back terrifying memories. And on top of that, with every year since going away to college I have developed what I can only describe as post traumatic stress from having left home at that time, and missing out on time with my parents, now passed. In short, I guess I never understood why I felt no comfort or consolation when I was in Medjugorje, experiencing such inner trauma. That does keep me a bit more reserved about its validity. I went on too long and deep here, and am not seeking any advice or councel ( well intentioned as it may be), and nor am I arguing the validity of Medjugorje. Im simply stating my view on it, sprinkled with a few personal stories. PS…Regarding Glenn, I know that he devotes much of his time and life promoting, explaining, re explaining and then re explaining even more, all things related to Garabandal. And over the years, even on this very board, I’ve seen him have to deal with comments not always put in the best way, or comments that show the poster was speaking with authority without being fully informed, first. Im not suggesting that’s the case going on above at all. I havent read most of the exchange. I just know Glenn has a sometimes very difficult job that I don’t think any of us can fully comprehend. I remain grateful for his posts on the apparitions at Garabandal which, as I stated, I believe to be valid.
I'm sorry it did not pan out as you had hoped. I'll pray for spiritual relief from your agorphobia. Lord have Mercy! O Mary conceived without sin, pray for Mark who has recourse to thee!
I guess I am allowed to state my opinion too here. I'M firmly in the camp that you are not "spiritually wiser" than SAINT PADRE PIO.
