Is Trump really pro life, or is he just pandering for votes?

Thank you! That’s so sweet. I am glad to have met everyone here and have really enjoyed learning so much from everyone

 

Don't be fooled by the people who claim that improved health and social welfare systems will reduce or eliminate abortion. If that were the case, there would be no or hardly any abortions in Europe where there are variations of the systems they want. They're lying to you and they know it. It's particularly shameful for Catholics to use that as cover for supporting abortion. I'm dumbfounded that Bishops are using such weasel words to gloss over it.

And don't be in a rush to ditch your two party system. Europe's multi-party systems lead to all sorts of problems where an election can produce no clear winner. When that happens it can take months of negotiations to settle on a government with minority parties representing a small fraction of the electorate producing a tail wagging the dog situation. The policy that convinced you to vote for a particular party could be the first policy to be jettisoned when the negotiations begin. There are pluses and minuses to both systems.

Trump is no more divisive than Obama was. From the outside looking in, it seems to me that the divisions in American society have been building up for a long time. The press played it down when their favourites were in office. It suits the Democrats now to fan the flames and the media are playing their part by blaming it all on Trump. That they use race to do it is despicable.

They make a big deal about Trump being unpopular with America's allies. Why is he unpopular? Because he expects rich NATO countries to pay their fair share of the cost of protecting their own countries? Why would any American tax payer object to that? Is it because he wants more favourable trade deals for the US? Why would any American based business hold that that against him? Is it because he wants international organisations that get the bulk of their funding from the US to start delivering value for money? Why would any American taxpayer object to that? Is it because he want giant US companies to stop exporting jobs to cheap labour markets? Why would any American worker object to that? Is it because he wants immigrants to enter by the legal route and criminal immigrants to be deported? Why would any peace loving American have a problem with that? What kind of leader gives preference to foreign nationals to the detriment of his own citizens?

It seems to me that the biggest contrast between Trump and the previous administration has been on the international stage. If Obama hadn't been America's first Black President, world leaders and especially the world's press would have castigated him for the disaster he was. I know that Trump has had a succession of Secretaries of State and Pompeo seems to be the best of them but none of them could be worse than Clinton or Kerry. It was an embarrassment watching Russia's Lavrov make them look like first year apprentices. The same people who never saw a country they didn't want to interfere with are screaming about Russian interference in the US!!! It would be comical if they hadn't been the cause of so much mayhem and death. Obama will be forever linked to ISIS. And did you know that the US has a very long history of spying on the German Chancellor? They even bugged Merkel's 'phone! Obama made no secret that he wanted Turkey in the EU. He was so into the Muslim Brotherhood, he would have destroyed what's left of the European project. (We Europeans are well capable of destroying Europe without a nudge from the outside. We've had plenty of practice. ‍♂️)

It seems to me that not a small factor in your current problems is down to the Democratic party's fondness for organising a "Spring" against any foreign government they didn't like. Aided and abetted, of course, by the late John McCain who never sniffed a foreign conflict he didn't want the US involved in. Regime change being part of their modus operandi they thought they'd try it at home and set the ball rolling before Trump was sworn into office. The "Democratic Party" has to be the misnomer of all time. And as to empowering women. Clinton rose up the ranks on her husband's coat tails and is famous (or infamous) bad mouthing the women who accused him of sexual misbehaviour. She surely used more than a rag to wipe that dirt. Harris broke the glass ceiling thanks to being the bit on the side for a married man twice her age. I suppose it's to her credit that she wasn't a cheap trick - I read that he bought her an expensive car. Some role models for young women!!! Is it any wonder that the likes of AOC is their hope for the future?

So, you can vote third party knowing that you struck a blow against a man whose personality is repulsive to you. Just bear in mind what the suave and politically correct Clintons, Bushes and Obamas have done to your country and ask yourself could Trump at his worst be worse than Biden who supported Clinton and Obama in every rotten move. Also, Biden seems to be a sandwich short of a picnic and there's a real,possibility that he won't last four years. If anyone could be worse than Obama, Harris is the stand-out candidate.

I didn't intend to write an essay but there's a lot at stake and not just for the US.
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It is simple for me.

Since 1980 over 1.5 billion inocent children have been killed by abortion worldwide.

An estimated 150 million to 1 billion people have died in war over the entire course of human history.

Abortion has killed more people since 1980 than every single war combined since the begining of the human race!

ANY politician who supports this slaughter is disqualified in my mind to hold any office.

By the way, in the time it took you to read this post aproximetly 50 innocent children had thier lives snuffed out by abortion...

http://www.numberofabortions.com/

 

Someone please explain to me how on earth a vote for someone who is divorce and remarried 3x and supports LGBT is a vote for what God wants? To me it’s like boiling a frog. I can’t believe that good Catholics are so adamant about Trump.

 

I don't believe he's what God wants. Is God's candidate running for office?

 

If you believe some - and I don’t mean you- apparently so.

 

No one here is saying Trump is a perfect candidate. That is a red herring argument.

Is LGBQ support or marriage history as important as 60 million innocent lives lost in the USA by abortion?

 

Yes. My jaw has dropped at times at some of the praise heaped on him. The bottom line is that he's all you've got now to get the message through to the Democrats and some Republicans that the right to life comes from God.

 

You tell me.

A sin that wiped out Sodom and Gomorrah doesn’t seem like a no brainer to me.

And if we vote for the establishment candidate because they are better than what is worse, we will never get a candidate that will make a difference.

 

That's my point as well. As I have stated before; the very act of voting will always be to elect the lesser of two evils, at least in the U.S. with a two party system. Expecting this fact to change is an exercise in self-delusion.

Every man on earth is a sinner. There will never be the perfect flawless candidate. (Though Dr. Ron Paul, came the closest to that ) It's about ranking things in order of preferences. We must look in our hearts and see where abortion ranks personally within ourselves and through the eyes of GOD. Even, Christ himself pointed to some sins being unforgivable than others. That shows that even God himself ranks sins. I can think of NO other sin besides the blaspheming of the Holy Spirit, but killing of the unborn as being the 2nd most worse offense.

 

Perhaps, but perhaps the two party vote being the lessor of two evils wouldn’t have to be if the faithful actually forced the Republicans to pick a suitable candidate.

It seems that the saints have a stronger view on LGBT ways than you do:

https://onepeterfive.com/just-how-evil-is-sodomy-the-saints-weigh-in/

 

I don't' ever think those Saints on that list would have EVER dreamed that man would come-up with a system that would be so wicked as to KILL the unborn in the womb. Talk about crying out to God for vengeance.... Those are 60 million innocent voices that are crying out. I'm going-out on a limb here, but I would venture to think that the Lord, the Saints, the Virgin herself would rank the blood of the innocent children as far more important, wouldn't you?

 

Well Trump has stated publicly that he would not rule out appointing a judge who opposes gay marriage.

On the other hand we have a candidate in Biden who not only supports gay marriage but also every abortion up to the day of birth funded by our taxes.

Biden promotes the fact that he will require Catholic adoption agencies to place children in same sex "couple's" homes, unlike Trump. Biden also supports the "right" of people to determine their own gender, even children.

And no one in our current political reality has a REASONABLE chance of winning besides Trump or Biden.

I could vote for myself but that would be an excecize in futility.

Frodo, who do you propose we vote for in this election?

Biden supports all abortion and is more supportive of sodomites.

 

I’d go back to the catechism;

https://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s1c1a8.htm

1867 The catechetical tradition also recalls that there are "sins that cry to heaven": the blood of Abel,139 the sin of the Sodomites,140 the cry of the people oppressed in Egypt,141 the cry of the foreigner, the widow, and the orphan,142 injustice to the wage earner.143

Doesn’t seem as open and shut as you make it out to be.

And again, if the faithful would reject candidates that approved LGBT, they would soon stop giving us candidates that support that sin that cries for vengeance.

 

But I digress and also link to our Catechism regarding human life:
http://w2.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a5.htm

 

Not sure what 1897 has to do with it, but the fact that Sodomites are one of the sins that cry to heaven is very significant.

Why on earth are Catholics willing to go along with it?

This isn’t an evil vs a chosen one, at best this is Hitler vs Stalin.

 

To my mind, abortion is a direct challenge to the Holy Spirit. That's what puts it top of the list. There's no innocent victim in sodomy.

 

So tell us who can win this presidential election who is against gay "rights".

Biden is radically pro gay "rights".

 

Sins are not mutually exclusive. Both are deplorable...but they can be ranked. There are some sins worse than others. Both are horrible choices. Those that vote for Biden knowing what he stands for will have some accounting to do with the Lord. Voting for Trump will not make me accountable to the Lord for Trumps own personal buffoonery or poor lifestyle choices, those will be his own personal sins, that he will have to answer for.

 

Sodomy is abhorrent and as non sum dignus pointed out the democrats not only support LMNOPQ but also gay marriage, same sex adoption and transgenderism.

Mr trump has been enlightened with regards to the sacredness of all human life and hopefully the Holy Spirit will continue to enlighten him in regards to sodomy as well. I think he is the worlds best hope for Christian values to return, in the western world

It is interesting to note that the first of the sins that cry out to God for vengeance, is the murder/blood of the innocent.

1867 The catechetical tradition also recalls that there are "sins that cry to heaven": the blood of Abel,139 the sin of the Sodomites,140 the cry of the people oppressed in Egypt,141 the cry of the foreigner, the widow, and the orphan,142 injustice to the wage earner.143