The Vatican Has Fallen

Discussion in 'Church Critique' started by padraig, Dec 31, 2016.

  1. Jarg

    Jarg Archangels

    I agree and church teaches that (below) but we need to be specially careful and respectful when speaking directly of the pope and trust in God more than in our words, it is easy to forget this though. I find Anna Silvas a really good example in this sense.

    Cathechism 212 -3

    “According to the knowledge, competence, and prestige which they possess, they [the Christian faithful] have the right and even at times the duty to manifest to the sacred pastors their opinion on matters which pertain to the good of the Church and to make their opinion known to the rest of the Christian faithful, without prejudice to the integrity of faith and morals, with reverence toward their pastors, and attentive to common advantage and the dignity of persons.” (Canon 212 §3)”

    Still If the apostasy has already impreganated the upper crust of the Church, it is a problem that surpasses any us so much that the most efficient means of combatting it is prayer, prayer, prayer, so that this days may be shortened and the triumph of Immaculate Heart may come sooner!
     
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  2. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    I agree that prayer needs to be intensified. But we can surely speak up and also pray.
    May the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary be hastened!
     
  3. Mac

    Mac "To Jesus, through Mary"

  4. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    Cdl. Burke Directs Laity to Defend the Faith
    [​IMG]churchmilitant.com/news/article/cdl.-burke-directs-laity-to-defend-the-faith

    ROME (ChurchMilitant.com) - Cardinal Raymond Burke, former head of the Vatican's highest court, is giving laity their marching orders.

    In an interview published Sunday, Cdl. Burke calls upon the laity to stand up for their faith even when it means challenging priests and bishops. The cardinal spoke of Catholics "who are confused," who "feel abandoned in their Catholic faith," and who then "hear other Catholics or even their priests saying things that — or God forgive! — their bishops, saying things that contradict that faith."

    To these Catholics Cdl. Burke offers this directive: "I think the only way to go forward is simply to address the interlocutors who disagree with us, with the teaching of the Church in its deepest sense, and that is what we need right now."

    The "interlocutors" are specifically those who purport to speak for Pope Francis on his apostolic exhortation Amoris Laetitia in a way that contradicts the Catholic faith.

    This is surprisingly similar to the advice given by Bp. René Gracida, who told Church Militant during an interview in 2016:
    Even more important than someone saying this is the truth. We have people saying that Cdl. Burke for example or Cdl. Pell, you know they're saying the truth. What is more important in the present moment ... is for the people in the pew to rise up and say, in print, in letters, in phone calls, in emails, in person ... for the laity to say "No that is not true!"

    In his interview Sunday, Cdl. Burke offered his book, Remaining in the Truth, to the laity as a way for them to "deepen his or her appreciation of the constant teaching of the Church" on marriage and the sacraments. He co-authored the book with several other prelates as a response to the address given in February 2014 to the cardinals by Cdl. Walter Kasper.

    According to Cdl. Burke, Cdl. Kasper said that "the Church could change her practice with regard to the reception of the Sacraments by people in irregular unions without touching the doctrine on indissolubility."

    If the doctrinal development means that now, in the Church, those who are living in irregular matrimonial situations may receive the Sacraments, then this isn't doctrinal development: this is a change in the Church's teaching.Tweet
    "Doctrinal development," affirmed Cdl. Burke, "means that we have come to a deeper understanding of what is the constant teaching of the Church, and are able to give fuller expression to it." He added, "If the doctrinal development means that now, in the Church, those who are living in irregular matrimonial situations may receive the Sacraments, then this isn't doctrinal development: this is a change in the Church's teaching."

    This confusion and division, Cdl. Burke related, "is one of the reasons why, together with three other cardinals, we proposed these questions, or dubia, to the Pope: so that he could set this forth and dispel a great deal of this confusion."

    http://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/cdl.-burke-directs-laity-to-defend-the-faith
     
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  5. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    http://m.ncregister.com/blog/edward...altese-bishops-for-amoris-laetitia-guidelines

    Read the following article in light of the above linked article. The Maltese heretics were in the vanguard of pressing forward with Pope Francis' heterodox agenda on Communion for adulterers. This appears to be the next trial balloon on Pope Francis' heterodox agenda:


    http://wdtprs.com/blog/2017/04/malt...rchs-teachings-on-contraception-has-softened/

    Maltese Bp. Scicluna: The Church’s teachings on contraception has softened
    Posted on 7 April 2017 by Fr. John Zuhlsdorf
    [​IMG]

    I provide this as motivation for your own deepening of prayer and mortifications for Holy Church and for the protection of sound bishops and priests.

    From Malta Today:

    Archbishop on contraception: ‘Only if within marriage and not abortive’

    The Church’s teachings on contraception, though always tied to the tenet of sex belonging within the marriage, had softened in the past few years, as long as no life was lost in the process, Archbishop Charles J. Scicluna said on Thursday. [Is that so?]
    In a recorded interview on Xtra on TVM, the archbishop told Saviour Balzan that he was not condoning contraception at large. [Oh no. Of course you aren’t.]
    “One must remember that the Church always placed the argument in the context of marriage, and it holds on to the tenet of sex belonging within the marriage,” he said.
    “What we are saying is that if you have to use a contraceptive, make sure it is not one that kills life.”

    […]

    Scicluna is part of the “Maltese Fiasco”. He and the other bishop in Malta issued guidelines on chapter 8 of Amoris laetitia which, effectively, abolish the Magisterium of John Paul II. He is, apparently, now emboldened to go after Paul VI.

    They never just come straight out and say it. They insinuate. People then hear what they want to hear and that becomes the new truth. Bit by bit they chip away at doctrine.

    The combox is closed.
     
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  6. Don_D

    Don_D ¡Viva Cristo Rey!

    It appears that the seeds have most definitely been planted.

    http://www.churchmilitant.com/news/...-campaign-plots-revolution-in-catholic-church

    WIKILEAKS: HILLARY CLINTON CAMPAIGN PLOTS REVOLUTION IN CATHOLIC CHURCH

    by Rodney Pelletier • ChurchMilitant.com • October 12, 2016 124 Comments
    We will "demand the end of a middle ages dictatorship"
    DETROIT (ChurchMilitant.com) - In a new Wikileaks exposé, John Podesta, campaign chief for Hillary Clinton, admits to creating an organization masquerading as Catholic in order to get Catholics to vote for liberal causes. Emails also show his friend Sandy Newman plotting liberal revolution within the Church, insisting they will "demand the end of a middle ages dictatorship."

    A Wikileaks email dump this morning reveals emails between Newman, founder and president of Voices for Progress, and Clinton campaign chair Podesta in 2012 complaining about the U.S. bishops and their fight against the HHS Mandate. Newman wrote:

    This whole controversy with the bishops opposing contraceptive coverage even though 98% of Catholic women (and their conjugal partners) have used contraception has me thinking ... There needs to be a Catholic Spring, in which Catholics themselves demand the end of a middle ages dictatorship and the beginning of a little democracy and respect for gender equality in the Catholic church. (emphasis added)

    Newman continued, "Is contraceptive coverage an issue around which that could happen? The Bishops will undoubtedly continue the fight. Does the Catholic Hospital Association support of the Administration's new policy, together with 'the 98%' create an opportunity? "

    He went on to discuss planting the seeds of revolution in the Church: "I have not thought at all about how one would 'plant the seeds of the revolution,' or who would plant them" (emphasis added).

    Podesta answers: "We created Catholics in Alliance for the Common Good to organize for a moment like this."

    Catholics in Alliance for the Common Good is a Catholic outreach whose true agenda is to liberalize Church teaching on abortion, contraception and gay marriage, among other things. The group uses the cover of Pope Francis and his "message of inclusion," and cites magisterial documents claiming to support "human dignity," "the common good," "economic justice," "stewardship of God's creation," nuclear "disarmament," and other commonly proffered social justice issues.

    Podesta went on in the same email to clarify that this revolution will have to be a grassroots effort: "Like most Spring movements, I think this one will have to be bottom up."

     
  7. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    What utter tosh from the Bishop of Malta.

    View attachment 6313
     
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  8. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    And we have our 'homo philia' friends too high up in the Vatican as well.

    [​IMG]

    Cardinal Kevin Farrell, appointed by Pope Francis to head the Vatican's life and family dicastery, called James Martin's book "a welcome and much-needed book that will help bishops, priests, pastoral associates, and all church leaders more compassionately minister to the LGBT community.

    Newark Cardinal Joseph Tobin, made a cardinal by Pope Francis, endorsed the book: "In too many parts of our church LGBT people have been made to feel unwelcome, excluded, and even shamed. Father Martin’s brave, prophetic, and inspiring new book marks an essential step in inviting church leaders to minister with more compassion, and in reminding LGBT Catholics that they are as much a part of our church as any other Catholic."

    https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/francis-appointed-cardinals-back-jesuits-pro-lgbt-book

    Compassion = truth

    Homosexuality = perversion.

    LGBT = slavery to sin and eternal perdition.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2017
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  9. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    [​IMG]

    San Diego Bishop Robert McElroy has suggested there is an "anti-gay prejudice that exists in our Catholic community and in our country.

    "My own view is that much of the destructive attitude of many Catholics to the gay and lesbian community is motivated by a failure to comprehend the totality of the church’s teaching on homosexuality," McElroy told America magazine. Labeling homosexual acts as "intrinsically disordered," as the Catechism does, is "very destructive language that I think we should not use pastorally.

    God love anyone who has this man as a Bishop!

    He is on the road to perdition and taking many souls with him.
     
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  10. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    Considering Paglia's homoerotic mural in his Spanish diocesan Cathedral, subsequent promotions within this Vatican, and all the other active homosexuals Pope Francis has promoted, this elevation of the gay agenda seems an integral part of Pope Francis' agenda.

    But "who am I to judge?"
     
  11. Fatima

    Fatima Powers

    Poor Bishop who feels the Catechism of the Catholic Church is destructive language. Maybe he would rather use scripture to describe the condition of practicing homosexuals "no Sodomite shall enter the kingdom of heaven". I am sure the words of scripture would be much more "pastorally". These bishops and priests have lost their faith and need our prayers.
     
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  12. Fatima

    Fatima Powers

    They could save allot of trees in printing books like this if they are truly concerned about the well being of the LGBT community by printing only the cover of a book that St. John the Baptist coined, "REPENT AND BE SAVED". This would be the most compassionate thing one could say to the person in deadly sin and you would not needs pages of spin in false compassion.
     
  13. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    There are certain issues that have the heretics exposed --

    Contraception, abortion and homosexual acts are intrinsically evil acts.

    So when they 'spin' these issues they expose themselves as ones who lead the flock astray.

    Interestingly all three of these sins are connected to each other as sins of the flesh.
     
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  14. Fatima

    Fatima Powers

    Our Lady of Fatima:
    1) "More souls go to Hell because of the sins of the flesh than for any other reason."
    2) "Certain fashions are being introduced that offend Our Lord very much."
    3) "Many marriages are not good; they do not please Our Lord and are not of God."
    4) "Pray, pray a great deal, and make sacrifices for sinners, for many souls go to Hell because they have no-one to make sacrifices and pray for them."
    5) ""I have come to warn the faithful to amend their lives and ask pardon for their sins. They must not continue to offend Our Lord, Who is already too much offended."
    6) "Wars are a punishment for the sins of mankind."
     
  15. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    With views like that our Lady is in danger of being condemned as a rigid, self absorbed neo-pelagianist by modernists in the Church.

    But, then again, the modernist does not pray the Rosary.

    The modernist does not know our Lady. For to know our Lady is to know Jesus.
     
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  16. Jarg

    Jarg Archangels

    It seems to me this, with intercommunion, is the true battle - the communion remarried divorcees was just To set the engine in motion. This book, what it represents, is that so called LGBT people do not need to change life to share in the sacraments. This imposture de-legitimizes the amazing apostolic movements like Courage in US or Philippe Ariño in Europe, and many others, that are changing so many lives of people with same sex attraction through the path of chastity. This imposture is what justifies homoerotic murals like the one Paglia commissioned for the Cathedral in Terni (not Spain as someone said).

    Philippe Ariño, a 'homosexual' witness himself, writes extensively on debunking the heterosexual-homosexual myth, and how to approach the LGBT apostolate with true and charity, not just charity.

    Courage produced this documentary about three amazing witnesses with same sex attraction now living in chastity after a long conversion. Totally worth watching:

    https://everlastinghills.org/movie/
     
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  17. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Seriously?
    Are we all just making up our own rules now?

    The Church has always taught any kind of contraception is an intrinsic evil. It is in the Catechism of the Catholic Church. It is wrong whether the means to prevent conception is abortive or not. It makes no difference if the couple using it is married or not. It is always evil. Under any circumstance.

    Catechism Of The Catholic Church

    2370 ...In contrast, "every action which, whether in anticipation of the conjugal act, or in its accomplishment, or in the development of its natural consequences, proposes, whether as an end or as a means, to render procreation impossible" is intrinsically evil.
    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a6.htm

    How much longer must this go on?
     
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  18. Aviso

    Aviso Guest

    Hi Praetorian my Friend, with all due Respect, please remind me since when you are back to the Catholic Church, some told me 2 Years only but reading your different comments I can not beleive them, please would you be kind to confirm it to me or not, by the way I am still waiting for your insights about Marian Apparitions roles, thank you.
     
  19. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Hi Aviso. I have been a Catholic all of my life, but I stopped going to Church or paying attention to religion in my early 20's (I am 44 now). I went my own way and lived a very earthly life of wine, women, and song. I came back to the sacraments on March 3rd of 2015, so I just celebrated my 2 year anniversary a little over a month ago. For several months before I officially came back I was in the process of conversion and so in that sense it is maybe 2 1/2 years since Our Lady gave me my faith back. When I came back to the Church for about a year and a half I read, watched and devoured just about anything I could about the current situation in the Church and I am pretty good at remembering what I learn. Honestly it felt like (and I am convinced it was) Our Lady giving me a "crash course" on what is happening.

    As far as the Marian Apparitions I haven't had much luck finding the source we had been talking about. I think it was in a talk. Probably from the Audio Sancto channel on Youtube. It wasn't just the standard guidelines used by the Church, but something more in-depth that someone the Church assigned to study apparitions would be more aware of. The Church looks at a lot more than just the basic guidelines they list for the public.

    Some of the criteria I remember were:

    Do the messages talk about trivial things. (How was the seers day at work? Did they pass their test in school?, etc.)

    Do the messages use "earthly language" (talk about cell phones, the stock market, etc.)

    Are the messages verbose? (Our Lady was known as a woman of few words and the devil is proud and loves to hear himself speak and flood us with false messages)

    Are the messages "boring" (This is a funny one, but I remember watching a video where the priest who was responsible for going through messages was saying he was bored out of his mind because most of the messages were repetitive drivel. Basically just a waste of time that sounded pleasant but really was just a bunch of "nothing".)

    These types of discernment criteria are more "art than science" but they help the officials who are studying apparitions tell where the messages are coming from. If I run across any of this again I will let you know.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2017
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  20. Aviso

    Aviso Guest

    Thanks Praetorian, so you are back to the Catholic Church since 2 years only as some told me, what do you mean by I watched and devoured just about anything ? what did you read ? would you be kind to quote to me your main readings, 1 or 2 books or links will be sufficient to me as about your Criteria about Marian Apparitions, I am sorry but wihout any official Church quotes, I should be obliged to wait further, thank you again.
     

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