1st class at that! It is a little dodgey really . The buying and selling of relics is an excommunication offense . But there are ways around that. http://www.ebay.com/itm/400936938301
Canon Law: (Ecclesiastical Law) * Canon 1171 - Sacred things which are destined for divine worship through dedication or a blessing are to be treated with reverence and not to be employed for improper or profane use even if they are under the control of private individuals. * Canon 1190 - It is strictly forbidden to sell sacred relics. * Canon 1376 - One who profanes a movable or immovable sacred thing is to be punished with a just penalty
And this is how they get around it... PLEASE NOTE THAT AS PER EBAY RULES AND REGULATIONS, AS WELL AS THE RULES OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH, WE ARE NOT SELLING ANY BODY PARTS OR HUMAN REMAINS. THE RELIC IS A GIFT WITH YOUR PURCHASE OF THE THECA.
I have thought about it. I will treat it will due respect. I am taking it out of unholy hands and I will protect it from all profanity. I am sure the Church has ransomed sacred objects in the past. The sin is in making gain from sacred objects. I am making a loss for its sake. The people who are selling obviously do not care about canon law. I do. I will not re-sell but will hand it on free of charge when the time comes. I hope I am not being conned.
Simony is the buying 0r selling of an office of the church or sacrament. My bid is therefore not Simony. I have looked up other sites too and am sure I am not guilty of sin. My motives are good and pure, free of greed or gain, full of reverence of the sacred object. I have no desire to encourage Simony by bidding on this object but to protect it from further desecration. The interpretation that bidding encourages Simony is non-canonical. We have enough rules without making up more off our own bat. I was doubtful at first but not now. I am sure some sanctimonious specimen will still condemn me. Wish I had not posted about this.
I know someone who is planning on bidding on it. And was just looking at the issue . Didnt mean to upset you Joe ,sorry.
Around 1982, Mum and I heard of a Lady who who was around 70 years old at the time and she lived outside of Coffs Harbour and she had in her possession a large Crucifix that had bleed. A small group of ladies from our Parish were invited to meet her at her home and to veiw the crucifix. This is her story. This Lady had heard of a small Catholic church that was being sold and that many of the items in the church were to be auctioned off. She was horrified and contacted the church authorities but to no avail so she marched off to the auction and had severe words with the auctioneer and all present that they were not to auction sacred things, but the auction went on. So she had no choice but to stay there and give a donation for most of these sacred items and she tried to save most of them. So as the items were auctioned she waited for the last bid, and then said just before the hammer went down she would donate a slightly higher some of money for the item. From what I can remember she ended up with all the stations of the cross, plus a very large crucifix. Apparenly some very, lucky?, person bought all the red cedar pews for a steal. She took the sacred items home and was in the process of donating them back to the church archives and she was having problems with this. She placed all these sacred and blessed items in her spare room that she had and she lay the crucifix on the single bed and it just fit on the bed. She would go in to pray her rosary. An amazing thing happened. One day as she was entering the room she noticed that the feet of our Lord on the Cross looked like it was bleeding, she immediately placed her finger on the wound on the feet of the statue and sure enough it was, she fell on her knees and placed her finger in her mouth and prayed, she then rang the parish office, contacted the Bishop and got some sort of investigation happening, however at the time I remember her being very upset with the proceedings. I don' know what eventually happened. The bleeding apparently continued on and off for 2 weeks and the blood never dripped off the crucifix. Apparently it happened in front of the priest that was investigating the matter. The crucifix was not bleeding when I was there but a very strange phenonomen happened; as we prayed the rosary around the bed, the body statue of Jesus on the crucifix, looked as if it was breathing, with a rise and a fall of the chest continually while we said the rosary, but this stopped after the rosary was completed and we all witnessed this. It was a very sobering and holy experience. These Sacred items should not have been put up for auction but I believe this lady was rewarded for her faith, even though she did not see it this way; she believed that this was a sign that Jesus was hurt anew.
I do not believe in the selling of sacred items. However, I do believe in some cases one must rescue scared holy items lest they fall into less than desirable hands (if you do; have purchased) than by divine providence I believe it has fallen into the right hands. May my sister and guide, St. Therese guide you also. God bless!
Many years ago I purchased a first class relic of St Therese in Rome for a relative. As far as I recall it was close to st John laterns and it was an official place run by nuns. They probably called it a donation. I don't see it as simeony. After all there is expense involved in producing it. I agree with Joe that we are being over legalistic. It's the intention of the heart that matters surely.
I have a friend that works for the Vatican who specializes in antiquities. He goes to Churches and Convents that are closing in Europe and brings back the relics and sacred items to be cataloged and stored by the Vatican. There are SO many now and even churches that want all the relics just removed, that they only care about the relics that have their certificate of Authenticity with them. Many of these relics are so old that the certificate is misplaced or just missing, but the relics are real. Some of the Convents are selling all the relics on Ebay themselves for extra money because they no longer want them. A lot of persons who handle estates for deceased relatives also will sell these relics because they do not want them. Then there are a lot of unsavory persons that make fake relics to sell. Anyway, it's a shame that this is happening. I have "rescued" several authentic off Ebay years ago and have a few First Class with Authenticities from the main Carmelite Saints. My FAVORITE though was given to me by my above mentioned friend. It is a piece of the Shroud of Turin in a reliquary from 1630. It has no certificate, but his professional opinion is that it is real.
Here's a recent response from Fr. Z about this issue: ASK FATHER: Getting waxen “Agnus Dei” from schismatics 21 May 2015 • By Fr. John Zuhlsdorf ShareTweet+ 1Mail From a reader… QUAERITUR: I recently obtained several Agnus Dei from Sisters in a traditional, cloistered order here in the U.S. They supposedly procure a smaller amount of the blessed wax from an original Agnus Dei from the pontificate of Pope Leo XIII. The items were purchased, with money exchanging hands for the item holding the Agnus Dei as well as work involved by the Sisters, but the blessed wax is a gift (to avoid simony and maintain the original blessing?). I recently discovered that the Sisters are part of a schismatic group that are under the direction of a local bishop. Would this invalidate the blessings and graces associated with the pious wearing of an Agnus Dei? Is it wrong or sinful to support such a group through the purchase of their religious items? Fr Z's Answer: Since they are gifts there no problem at all. Furthermore, it is not wrong to obtain (some would say “rescue” objects such as this from schismatic groups or others, the nefarious people who traffic in relics on Ebay, etc. Some of you might not know what an Agnus Dei is. These objects are discs, round or oval, of bees wax impressed with the figure of a lamb, usually with the flag, and saints on the reverse. They were blessed by the Pope. Sometimes they were worn around the neck. They are sacramentals. In history they go back to at least the 9th c.
Thats a wonderful story Josephite . A case of the right person at the right place at the right time .What has become of this Crucifix? I spoke to my friend this morning and he has decided to stay away from this or any other ebay sales.
Hi Mac First of all I am grateful for all the responses on this issue.....including yours. Between my exhaustion and arrogance I crushed that still small voice of truth. On reflection I admit that, after all, I had reservations. I have discussed this with others too and come to the same conclusion. My salvation does not depend on having this relic. My salvation depends on me acting in good conscience. While every thing I said before about my intentions and motivation was true I now clearly see that my primary motive was not to deliver or protect or venerate this relic but to obtain the grace it contains for myself: my primary motive was selfish. What was in for me, that was how I was thinking. I did not really consider what harm my actions may cause others. Grace cannot be bought. I was trying to buy grace therefore, for me, this was wrong. What a difference in this and the way in which I came into possession of my other relics that came to me through holy charity. In my hot-headedness I have already put in a bid which I cannot withdraw but now that my thinking is clear, if the relic comes to me, so be it. If I am out-bid I will not bid again and like your friend will stay away from this sort of thing in the future. I leave it in the hands of The Little Flower. I ask your forgiveness Mac, for my angry response.
I like your honesty and sincerity. Like I said. If it does fall into your hands then it would seem to me that this relic is in good hands indeed. Bless you!
