Our Lady of Fatima travels to Rome at the request of two Popes

Yes I realize this has already taken place,...sadly many Catholic Churches have taken on the appearance of secularized Protestant Churches. Many have left the Church and worship the self God. Our local priest sees "flaws" in Humane Vitae..ect. So you don't pull any punches..that's good,..I like that I kind of had a feeling that post who have brought about that type of response,..and you are totally right! I guess what I meant is something on a grander scale,..where some Bishops will openly oppose the Pope and the Bishops in communion with him and those who may refuse to submit to Our lady wishes.
In other words,..I think maybe,..we aint seen nothing yet.

 

Yes I agree Michael Voris did a study on all that and how everything went down hill after Vatican II called Rebellion in the Church,..it's on youtube and I think he is spot on.
I guess my point is, not all the Bishops will go along with the Pope and we will see open rebellion,..not a very pleasant thought

 

I got called away from the computer, when I read your post back away Sunburst, and I was going to respond with exactly that. To put it bluntly, satan stole God's plan of Vatican II. There was a great outpouring of the Holy Spirit in the sixties and satan stole God's plan for that. Christians have and are being persecuted and churches are desecrated and ransacked. Bishops and priests have turned away from the Church, scandalized the Church, left it and have given bad teachings. In Kibeho, Our Lady said she was giving a warning to the whole world. The people in Rwanda were sitting there pleasantly one day and the next day running for their lives and being butchered, sometimes by Roman Catholic priests. There was a saying at the time, that there was no devils left in hell, they were all in Rwanda. We as lay people are to blame too. We stopped praying, for our families, our priests, our church and our countries. Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea culpa.
In the end Our Lady's Immaculate Heart will triumph, but before then,
We ain't seen nothing yet.
We are living in a time of great grace, given to us by Our Lady's intercession, our refuge is in her Immaculate Heart, our hope in Jesus, our protection under their mantles, in total surrender to Jesus, through Mary. St. Michael defend us, St. Joseph, Terror of demons, protect us. Father in heaven, may we walk in the wisdom of the Holy Spirit.
Pray, pray, pray!

 

La Salette seems to get over looked, wow this is pretty bleak...Taken in context with all the appearances of Our Lady this makes more sense than standing as single prophecy.

http://www.catholicplanet.com/future/lasalette-melanie.htm

If the third Fatima secret is even worst that this, man we are in trouble.
I always keep in mind "My Immaculate Heart Will Triumph In The End."


The secret given by the Virgin Mary to Melanie Mathieu (Calvat) at La Salette, France in September of 1846. The words in italics are Melanie's comments concerning the Virgin Mary's words.


17. ‘Civil rulers will have all one same design which will be to abolish, and to make disappear all religious principle, in order to make way for materialism, atheism, spiritualism and all kinds of vices.’ 18. ‘In the year 1865, the abomination will be seen in holy places; in convents, the flowers of the Church will be decayed and the demon will make himself as the king of hearts. May those who are at the head of religious communities keep themselves on guard for persons whom they must receive, because the demon will use of all his malice in order to introduce into religious orders persons devoted to sin, for disorders and the love of carnal pleasures will be spread by all the earth.’

19. ‘France, Italy, Spain and England will be in war; blood will flow in the streets; Frenchman will fight with Frenchman, Italian with Italian; subsequently there will be a general war which will be appalling. For a time, God will no longer be mindful of France or Italy, because the Gospel of Jesus Christ is no longer known. The wicked will deploy all their malice; they will kill themselves, they will massacre themselves mutually even in the houses.’

20. ‘At the first stroke of His lightning sword, the mountains and the whole of nature will tremble with terror, because the disorders and the crimes of men pierce the vault of the heavens. Paris will be burned and Marseilles engulfed; several great cities will be shaken and engulfed by earthquakes: it will be believed that all is lost: only homicides will be seen, only the noise of weapons and blasphemies will be heard. The just will suffer much; their prayers, their penances and their tears will climb even up to heaven and all the people of God will ask for forgiveness and mercy, and will ask for my help and my intercession. Then Jesus Christ by an act of His justice and of His great mercy for the just, will command to His angels that all His enemies be put to death. All at once the persecutors of the Church of Jesus Christ and all men devoted to sin will perish, and the earth will become like a desert. Then peace, the reconciliation of God with men will be made; Jesus Christ will be served, adored and glorified; charity will flower everywhere. The new kings will be the right arm of the holy Church, which will be strong, humble, pious, poor, zealous and imitator of the virtues of Jesus Christ. The Gospel will be preached everywhere and men will make great progress in the faith, because there will be unity among the workers of Jesus Christ and because men will live in the fear of God.’


21. ‘This peace among men will not be long; 25 years of abundant harvests will make them forget that the sins of men are the cause of all the pains which come upon the earth.’












22.‘A forerunner of the Antichrist with his troops from several nations will fight against the true Christ, the only Savior of the world; he will spill much blood, and will want to annihilate the worship of God in order to make himself be looked upon as a God.’

 

You really have it in for poor Cardinal Bertone, Marti!!
Remind me not to fall out with you.

 

I love you too much Padraig! I pray for the poor man. May God have mercy on his soul... I would NOT want to be him when he sees our Lady...

 

I have come to believe that the "consecration" is in reality, an exorcism of the church. Christ has told us we have to have faith as a child , to do the consecration is exactly that. If we are to believe what Fr Malachi Martin has told us about Satan being enthroned in our church. it must take such an act of "childish" faith to once again consecrate and purify His church. Trust.

 

I think its important to remember that Vatican 2 was a Church Council and as such was the working of the Holy Spirit.

One time before the Council Pope John 23rd was talking to his secretary , (now Bishop) Loris Capovilla about the possibility of having a Council . Fr Loris balked and hesitated, reflecting the dismay of the Vatican establishment at that time. Pope John told him he was think like a buisness CEO rather than a good Christian using Discernment. ..and what is Discernment? Discernment is to seek the Will of God. Blessed Pope John said he had done this. If Church Councils are wrong then the entire Church id wrong since we believe in the Magisterium. Extreme Traditionalists recognise this themselves when they talk of the Seat of Peter being, 'Sede Vacante' (unoccupied) from the reign of Pope Pius x11. In this they follow their own flawed heretical beliefs but to their credit follow their won flawed inner logic.

On the other hand I do not believe it is logical or correct to speak of this Council being , 'hijacked' since it places the work of the Holy Spirit being set at nought. ..and to imply that a Church Council was vain. This strikes me as treacherous waters and illogical. For if this was the work of the Spirit how can God's work be, 'hijacked'. Either it was God's work or it was not.

It is true some wicked folk used the Council for their own wicked ends.

But much, much good came for the Council. If the Council had not taken place ..as God intended the Church now would have been in a far, far worse state.

A good example of what I mean was Canon Law. An old priest, a specialist in Canon Law told me that he counted one time 60 examples of, 'Mortal Sins' a priest could commit in the Sacristy before he even came out on the altar, by say, not putting his robes on right. All that is gone.

I think pre Vatican 2 the Holy Spirit, the freedom of the Children of God had been ossified or set in some kind of stone. The Holy Spirit is fire and wind and water and must be free to renew and set on fire. We cannot set the Spirit in men's stonework of laws and codifications and false practises. So God from time to time must come down and upset the apple cart and we must be open to him doing so.

 

Yes, Marti, but what if you are mistaken and he is a good man?
After all which of us knows what is really going down inside the Vatican?

 

I believe if the Pope does as asked it will bring down the Illumination of Conscience almost at once. The greatest outpouring of the Holy Spirit since Pentecost.

I think a good way of looking at it is God's request to Abraham to sacrifice his son, Isaac. Abraham complied .as Far as God wished...then look what happened after , look at God's words....

Genesis 22

15 The angel of the Lord called to Abraham from heaven a second time 16 and said, “I swear by myself, declares the Lord, that because you have done this and have not withheld your son, your only son, 17 I will surely bless you and make your descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as the sand on the seashore. Your descendants will take possession of the cities of their enemies, 18 and through your offspring[b] all nations on earth will be blessed,[c] because you have obeyed me.”

So if we take these promises and apply them to the Church (after the Consecration} what does this mean?

I think it means the Illumination of Conscience.

 

Padraig said...I believe if the Pope does as asked it will bring down the Illumination of Conscience almost at once. The greatest outpouring of the Holy Spirit since Pentecost.

Thats of interest Padraig, never heard or thought of that one.Maybe your onto something here. I take it your just speculating? or something more ?

 

There are to many good and holy priests who have been severely persecuted that have come forward and risked everything to tell the truth. How about the five priests who were with him when he was to go into visit Lucia and at the last moment he said, "No, I will go in alone...." Those priests were threatened and now that they are old have come forward and said it was a sham. Personally, I think the butler who blew the whistle on Bertone' is a saint and I'm surprised that he isn't hanging under a bridge somewhere....
If I'm wrong, God have mercy on me. I've studied Freemasonry a long time now, and Josyp Terelya and Bishop Danylak could tell you stories that would make you cry buckets. The buck stopped at Bertone's desk...he should take responsibility...

SERMON IN A SENTENCE

"Freemasonry aims in particular to destroy the Catholic religion. Their deceits have been spread in the whole world, in different guises, but with the same old goal: religious indifference and weakening of moral forces according to their basic principle: 'We will conquer the Catholic Church not with argument, but rather with moral corruption.'”

-- St. Maximilian Kolbe

 

Fully agree with you on +Bertone MS, The great Fatima cover up began before him ,but he certainly has taken the reins.

 

Padraig said... Extreme Traditionalists recognise this themselves when they talk of the Seat of Peter being, 'Sede Vacante' (unoccupied) from the reign of Pope Pius x11.
Glad you mention them Padraig,I havent seen this topic on the forum since Ive been here.Loathesome people, and I know a few. They know their catechism, but WOW,. their pride is blinding. They hate the Fatima message.

 

sunburst said: ↑

"Yes I realize this has already taken place,...sadly many Catholic Churches have taken on the appearance of secularized Protestant Churches... In other words,..I think maybe,..we aint seen nothing yet."​

​

Churches and Altars will be sacked.

See this beautiful Altar? It is the high Altar of St. Joseph's Cathedral, my former parish and the Church in which I got married, City of Dunedin, South Island, New Zealand.



After Vatican II, some strange people connected to the Cathedral Parish decided this altar had to go. It was removed from the Church. The plan was to saw it up in to pieces and dump it in to the Sea. I'm not kidding.

The local Municipal Art Gallery mentioned that they might be able to find a place for it. So, a local Anglican artist went on a campaign to stop the Catholics from dumping it in the sea.

She raised enough money to have it transported and installed in the Art Gallery. It was in a sealed room, so could not be seen by the Public. In essence, the Art Gallery stored it. And thank God they did.

Many years went by. The Art Gallery offered it back to the Church. It was eventually reinstalled in its former place, at great cost to the Cathedral parish. But if the original Liturgy team had had their way, it would be in the ocean - in pieces.

This is of course is a prime example of what happened to so many Churches in so many countries that were infected with the "Spirit" of Vatican II. They were sacked - and their wealth and beauty was plundered.



Above are the doors of the Tabernacle of the beautiful altar.

When the High altar was taken away, a new concrete Altar was built. You should see the tabernacle that was commissioned to go with it. It is the ugliest thing - it has a copper door with a strange sort of "Renew" looking tree carved on it - & the tree appears to have strange demonic faces in it. Evidently the person who made it was a troubled soul. RIP. The less said about it, the better...

So there is the vandalism we see today where strangers come in and sacred things are spray painted, smashed, stolen, desecrated - and then there is another kind of vandalism, which was very prevalent around the 1970's, 80' and 90's, in the wake of the Akita warnings - which was carried out by Teams of "Liturgists". I'm not sure which kind is worse.

And then there is the outright destruction of Churches, by fire - which is happening right now in countries like Egypt. So yes, Sunburst is right, there is worse to come.

 

Sadly most parishes have similar stories Lumena, and I think we are all agreed on that.And were all agreed on 'The Holy Father will consecrate Russia, but it will be late'.Its just a matter of how late.Too late?

 

I recently had a patient in his 90's who LOVED the Church and all things Catholic. As long as he was able, he rounded up every Catholic in the nursing home and forced them to pray the rosary with him daily. His Pieta prayer book was in tatters, so I got him a new one, large print, and he wept with joy. But one thing bothered me. Every time we spoke, he pulled the conversation around to Pope John 23rd and Cardinal Bertone. His face would twist with hatred and he would say, "He was a devil! A devil from hell. And Bertone is a junior devil!" He reserved judgment on Pope Francis, waiting to see if he as a friend of Bertone. This hatred really worried me, and I prayed intensely for him. He had a touch of dementia, so I hoped his hatred was a result of his disease, not sin.

He died, quite peacefully, and I hoped he got to meet good Pope John and reconcile. Then a couple of days later, Bertone resigned. It made me wonder if it was through his intercession!

 

I have problems, problems, problems with these messages....................Something is not right.

Mary doesn't say things like "My Son came onto the scene....."

I would also like to hear people explain if there is a precedent for Mary calling the Church "My Church". Because she apparently does it 3 times in this message.......

Cardinal Ratzinger, writing in Called to Communion, states, “When I advocate a party, it thereby becomes my party, whereas the Church of Jesus Christ is never my Church but always his Church.”

Also, in other "messages" about Fatima, apparently, Our Lady, apparently, goes on and on about nuclear/atomic war in reference to the 3rd secret. Pope John Paul II said the chastisements mentioned in the 3rd secret are natural, and explicitly NOT nuclear war.

It is interesting that these "messages" also attempt to link Fatima with Medjugorje. I don't know, but to me these sound like somebody's personal dreams of what they would like the Virgin to say......................................................................................................................................................................

 

"Some wicked folk used the Council for their own wicked ends" - they certainly did! The ultra-liberal Association of Catholic Priests' of Ireland (some of whom deny that Jesus instituted a priesthood) never stop talking about Vatican II, the 'spirit of Vatican II' and the 'primacy of conscience' which they say it promoted above the Magisterium. Padre Pio refused to bless the post Vatican II constitution of his own order and demanded 'What are they doing in Rome?'. He also declined to offer the Novus Ordo Mass. So at least one saint appeared to have serious doubts about the results of the Council.
I remember the pre-Vat II Church and, believe me, it was a whole lot better than the situation we now suffer. I hear heresy regularly in homilies it never happened before the Council. I stand by what I said, men with little or no belief or heretical beliefs were involved and tried, with great success, in watering down 2000 years of dogma.

 

The Locutions to the World do not seem authentic. I was open to them at the time of waiting for the new pope to be elected, but when Pope Francis was elected and he was (according to media reports) the runner up from the 2005 election of Pope Benedict 16, that is when I stopped believing. As Corinthians Chap 13 verse 9....we know partially and we prophesy partially... Remember a few months ago when North Korea was threatening South Korea and some (me, too) were worried about nuclear war? Now they are making progress toward reconciliation. I don't think Our Lady wants us to believe that a Middle East war is a foregone conclusion. She said both in the Garabandal apparitions and the Medjugorje apparitions that there would not be a third world war. Like BC mentioned in one post, I also in the 1990's thought that all the locutions that came my way were authentic, yet low and behold the Father Gobbi time prophecy didn't occur (I loved Fr. Gobbi, but I guess he was wrong or the will of God changed). Teresa Lopez went away. Carol Ameche (Rest in peace) died without the US west coast collapsing (but there is probably still a lot of suffering ahead). The day of the consecration of the world to Our Lady of Fatima (March 25, 1984) was preceded by intense requests of Our Lady to a prayer group in Medjugorje led by Jelena. Every day in locutions she would tell them to pray and fast. Sometimes they had to go a few days of fasting and the pressure that Our Lady put lovingly on the teenagers was great. Then on the day of March 25, Our Lady expressed great gratitude to the young people in the prayer group. In messages to the seers (Vicka), she also expressed gratitude, like a great grace had been released. On that day March 25, 1984 the visionary of Venezuela Maria Esperanza had an apparition in front of 400 people who also saw the Blessed Mother. Maybe there weren't as many graces released for a triumph, but there were graces released (a nuclear exchange averted?) and here we are about 30 years later with a lot of conversions needed, but we should commit ourselves to prayer and fasting without believing that a nuclear war in the Middle East is prophecy according to the will of God.