Milleniarism, postmillenialism, premillenialism, amillenialism and Catholic Cathechism

Discussion in 'The Signs of the Times' started by insearch, Apr 28, 2013.

  1. Fatima

    Fatima Guest

    If Russia is not inherently evil, then why did our Lady of Fatima insist that the Holy Father, in union will all Bishops, consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary (which many believe has still not happened in the format requested by Mary). In fact Our Lady of Fatima said "it would come late". Keep in mind when our Lady is speaking about Russia, she is referring specifically towards is communist leadership, which is still in power today).
     
  2. Fatima

    Fatima Guest

    How do we know when the "revolution" is imminent? According to "Issue #5 of the Garabandal Journal" in a statement from "Garabandal - The Fingure of God", says: "The pope will go to Russia, to Moscow. As soon as he returns to the Vatican, hostilities will break out in different parts of Europe". Few believe that the coming Great Tribulation of Communism, because the world has been lulled into the false belief that Communism has died with the fall of the Berlin Wall and the dissolution of the Soviet Union. Well on March 10, 2011, James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, testified before a Senate hearing that "our greatest potential enemies are Russia and China.

    In reality, though, it is also the USA with its apostasy, secularism, impurity, abortions, anti-Catholic Church etc.. who is right behind the Communist principles, no doubt.
     
  3. mothersuperior7

    mothersuperior7 Powers

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2012
    Messages:
    3,837
    Gender:
    Female
    Sorry David, anyone from Ukraine or Russia will know that not ONE PERSON lost their job in Russia when the wall came down. Russia is more brutal than ever. They are just waiting for all the pieces to be in place. When I was in Ukraine I had visions of the concentration camps they have ready for the Ukrainian people. I saw the Russian soldiers who were marching through the city of LVIV, and I saw the crucifixes in the fields waiting for the priests and religious to crucify them....just like they did during the Armenian war....

    The West is certainly in the mix, but ALL KGB is required to be FREEMASONS. There are plenty of freemasons in the U.S. and all over the world working toward ONE GOAL....THE Destruction of Christianity--and the Catholic Church. And statistically speaking--Most Russian women use abortion for birth control. Six to eight abortions for one woman is not unheard of at all! Which is why Putin HAD TO DECLARE 'A Fornication Day' and even let people off work to go home and MAKE BABIES! (God have mercy!)

    Lets not have a punching match on who is worse, because Russia's sins are oozing out like blood under a stone. We openly sin and call it freedom. I'll take living in a Republic any day of the week over Communism...!
     
    insearch likes this.
  4. David Wilson

    David Wilson Guest


    Fatima,

    No human person or nation is inherently evil.

    To say that Russia under Communism was inherently evil is as fallacious as saying Germany under Nazism was inherently evil. Actually, for hundreds of years, both Russia and Germany were model Christian nations. It was only relatively recently that they were infected by the evils of Communism and Nazism. The Cathedral of Christ the Savior and the Assumption Cathedral were at the Kremlin before Stalin got there. When Stalin got there, he demolished the Cathedral of Christ the Savior. It has since been rebuilt.

    I don't know why Our Lady requested the Consecration, but I believe the fruits are visible. In the 1950s, Russia was one of the most brutal, atheistic regime on the planet. Since 1984, Russia has gone through what I believe can only be described as a supernatural transformation.

    Unfortunately, the "errors of Russia" did indeed spread and, sadly, they ended up here in the West.
     
    Donna A likes this.
  5. David Wilson

    David Wilson Guest


    I disagree with your assessment of Russia.

    I believe that the Consecration is bearing fruit and is now being met with fierce resistance by the Communistic West.

    One of the confirmations for me that the Consecration was bearing fruit was the public veneration of the Cincture of the Theotokos that happened in 2011. It was reported that over 2 million people (800,000) in Moscow alone venerated the relic, some enduring 12-15 hour wait times in subzero temperatures. Many government officials, including Putin and Medvedev, publicly venerated the relic. The New York Times gave the following report (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/24/w...y-belt-relic-draws-crowds-in-moscow.html?_r=0) of this unprecedented public veneration in the former "evil empire":

    "...Moscow’s city government closed streets around the cathedral - causing those Muscovites not so inclined to venerate relics to rant about the even-worse-than-usual traffic jams. Mobile canteens were set up to feed the pilgrims, and heated city buses lined the embankment to offer respite from the cold. A free bus service is shuttling provincial visitors to train stations. ​

    Moscow’s mayor, Sergei S. Sobyanin, came to inspect the scene. The benefactor of the St. Andrew the First-Called Foundation is Vladimir Yakunin, president of the Russian Railroads, who is close to Mr. Putin. At a news conference in October, Mr. Yakunin said the belt - usually kept at the Vatopedi Monastery on the Mount Athos peninsula in northern Greece, where women are not permitted - was known for promoting fertility. ​

    'The belt of the Most Holy Virgin Mary possesses miraculous power,' he said. 'It helps women and helps in childbirth. In our demographic situation, this is in and of itself important.'​

    It also seems to attract people who, having forsaken Russia’s deteriorating health system, are looking for something else. In recent years, Russians have thronged to relics of numerous saints, hoping to be cured of ills like cancer, debt and drunken husbands. ​

    'People come who apparently no longer have faith in medical care and await a miracle,' said the Rev. Mikhail Ryazantsev, the cathedral’s sacristan, who said the overwhelming majority were women. ​

    'Faith helps us live,' Dmitry Gurov, 27, who works in a bank and would seem to live the good life, said as he joined the line on Tuesday night. Yet not many miles from Moscow people may live without gas or running water. 'Life is hard in our country,' he said. 'We don’t know what will happen next.'"​

    When did Putin declare "fornication day"? That sounds like nonsense. What actually happened was that in 2008 Mrs. Medvedev and the Russian Orthodox Church started a holiday called "Day of Family, Love and Faithfullness" encouraging family values and childbirth.

    Medvedev signed the first national pro-life law since the fall of Communism in 2011 and his wife Svetlana actually started a campaign called "Give Me Life!" with a website calling for a "week against abortion" (http://www.lifenews.com/2011/07/15/russian-president-medvedev-signs-pro-life-bill-on-abortion-risks/) When was the last time we of any such thing from Western leaders?

    The reason that Putin is being demonized is because the Consecration is bearing real fruit.

    There ARE more legal restrictions in Russia right now on abortion and homosexuality than there are in the West. That's why Russia continues to be demonized by the West.

    Russia has not gone along with the Western plan for the destruction of Syria. That's why Russia is being demonized in the West.

    Russia has been cracking down on the corruption leftover from the Soviet era. Putin purged the corrupt Russian oligarchs - Abramovich, Khodorkovsky, Gusinsky, Berezovsky - who had taken control of the Yeltsin Administration (not to mention the Russian Media) in 1996 and had looted Russia's wealth and natural resources. Putin has also required the foreign NGOs to register as agents of foreign governments. For these and many more "offences" Putin has been predictably demonized.

    In Russia, public displays of homosexuality are restricted. In the West, homosexual "marriage" is being embraced in public law.
     
  6. garabandal

    garabandal Powers

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2008
    Messages:
    13,363
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Ireland
    Really? There are over 2 and a half million abortions per year in Russia. Since 1984 then there have been over 35 million abortions in that country.

    http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_abo-health-abortions
     
  7. mothersuperior7

    mothersuperior7 Powers

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2012
    Messages:
    3,837
    Gender:
    Female

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6990802.stm

    BBC Russian 'sex day' to boost births

    You said, "That's why Russia is being demonized in the West."

    Yeah, Putin is pretty impressive. Sociopath, frightening, and brutal, but yes, impressive. I respect his strength and general badassery, but definitely not his stranglehold over his power base. It is a rare man that you can both admire and despise. In all honesty it's a little hard to believe he is a product of modern times, it seems like he belongs in ancient Greece or the like--kicking ass, taking names, showering affection on animals for charity, silently assassinating his enemies, and cutting down civil liberties.
    I genuinely think he is evil and equally as genuinely am disturbed by him. He makes Obama look like a mama's boy.

    "Vladimir Lenin, founder of the Soviet state and a lawyer by training, wrote: “The courts should not do away with terror — to promise otherwise would be to deceive ourselves and others — but should give it foundation and legality, clearly, honestly and without embellishments.” One wonders if the sorcerer has become a role model for the apprentice. Putin has called Stalin “an effective manager.”
    In this spirit, three weeks ago, the Duma unanimously passed new amendments proposed by the F.S.B. that will expand the definition of “high treason.” The charge now can be applied to almost any Russian citizen who works with foreign organizations or has ever had contact with a foreigner.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/19/opinion/putins-new-fortress-russia.html?_r=0


    Seriously? ? Have you read any of Josyp Terelya's books? Do you know any Ukrainians? Putin is as evil as ever and his great 'devotion' to 'the Church' is ONLY TO THE STATE RUN RUSSIAN ORTHODOX who have priests who have to divulge the confessions of prominent people to the KGB! I met one of these priests in Ukraine who was Russian and ordained in the Russian Orthodox Church! He was totally tricked and escaped to Ukraine and to the Ukrainian Catholic Church. His experience was horrible...


    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1470259/posts

    This was first published in 2003, then again in 2005 and you and everyone else should do some homework...
    HERE ARE A FEW LINES FROM THE LETTER...

    Back in 1992, Bishop (now Metropolitan) Chrysostom of Vilnius and Lithuania, told a session of the Archbishops Assembly of the Russian Orthodox Church: "We have real KGB men within our Church who have made a brilliant career - say, Metropolitan Methodius of Voronezh. He is a KGB officer, an atheist, a depraved person who was sponsored by the KGB. The Synod was unanimously against that bishop, but we had to commit a sin; now consider his meteoric rise."

    The Assembly, which heard such grave accusations against Methodius, kept silence; the Holy Synod, which was said to be unanimously against the bishop, kept silence; Methodius himself kept silence, and is silent to date. Hardly anyone will disagree that such eloquent silence is louder than the loudest shouting.

    The Assembly also elected a commission, comprised of eight young bishops, to look into the allegations of our priests' possible involvement with the KGB. The commission is chaired by Archbishop Alexander of Kostroma and Galich, who is my bishop. For the past 11 years I have been humbly asking His Eminence, both orally and in writing, to say a couple of words about the results of the commission's investigation. All I got in reply was the same eloquent silence.

    .......The year the millennium of the baptism of Rus was celebrated, he was reportedly awarded a special diploma from the KGB, signed by Vladimir Kryuchkov. But it was never reported that Alexy is a career KGB officer. Plenty has already been said about the most likely aspirant - importantly, not by sensation-seeking journalists, but by his brother in faith and member of the clergy - a bishop of the Russian Orthodox Church.

    I will be frank and say that I was afraid to write and publish this letter: It is very dangerous to stand in the way of such people as Metropolitans Cyril and Methodius, impeding their great-power aspirations. This must be why I hesitated for a month. Yet I am even more afraid to become an accomplice to treachery.

    There is a popular myth that our high priests were "forced," "coerced" into collaborating with the belligerent atheists, into lying to the whole world about the great freedom of conscience in the Soviet Union and praising the Brezhnev-era Constitution. Unfortunately, none of the high priests have as yet said exactly how they were "forced" and "coerced" at a time when no one could any longer be threatened with a gun or labor camp.

    I would very much like to hope that in a dozen years after a possible enthronement of the "KGB officer, atheist and depraved person," some bishop who took part in that Assembly meeting, will not reveal the terrible secret to us: "The entire Assembly was unanimously against that candidate for Patriarch of Moscow and All Russia, but we had to commit a sin."

     
    insearch likes this.
  8. mothersuperior7

    mothersuperior7 Powers

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2012
    Messages:
    3,837
    Gender:
    Female
    LOCUTIONS.ORG


    Russia – The Evil Empire
    OCTOBER 5, 2012

    I speak so clearly because the time is short and the dangers are great. Mankind cannot grasp the importance of these days and months. So, I reveal these truths and show everything that will happen in as concise a manner as possible.
    When destruction breaks out, man will begin to unleash the terrible weapons that he has stored up, but has never dared to reach for. Moderation will be pushed aside. Whatever can be unleashed will be unleashed. The Great Powers will stay on the sidelines, feeling that those involved in these conflicts will soon spend themselves and these fires will go out. All of this is a mistake. Steps should have been taken earlier to prevent these smaller nations from gaining these weapons. Instead, the growth of armaments was overlooked and pushed aside. Decisions were not made.
    All of this happens because the relationship between America and Russia is still one of rivalry and not friendship. This so-called friendship is a lie that has prevented steps from being taken that would have insured world peace. Russia has been allowed back onto the world stage.
    OC

    Now, it is too late to restrict Russia’s powers. She has been allowed to regain her strength and also her position. This is the goal of her leader – to make Russia what she formerly was, a super-power to be reckoned with and feared. One path has been blocked. Due to the prayers of my people, those countries that were once subjugated to her have gained their freedom and no longer support her empire, her evil empire.
    Russia moves behind the scenes. The empire is gone but the evil remains and tries to find other means to control and dominate. She makes alliances with those who share her hatred for America. She schemes with them while smiling at America (as if her heart had changed). Can you not read her smile? It is a smile of betrayal and of ridicule, that covers over the truth. When will you see, America, that Russia has always remained your enemy? She hid this truth to deceive you.
    OCT

    Now, it is late. Russia has been allowed to form alliances. Her new friends have been allowed to gain strength. Soon they will all oppose you. Are you surprised? Does this cause you wonder? Anyone with a keen eye could easily see. You have been deceived by the Evil One, failing to judge truthfully when all the signs were clear. Now, you can only reap the harvest of your blindness and deceit. The fruits will not be slow in coming.
    Why do I speak when your decisions have already been made? I want to rip away the mask that Russia has placed over your eyes. There is no need to continue to walk this dark road which will lead only to the destruction of your sons, your daughters, and your friends.
    America, take up again your former position. Russia is your sworn enemy, and you foolishly sign treaties with her. I weep over you, foolish America.
     
    insearch likes this.
  9. stephen

    stephen Angels

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2013
    Messages:
    212
    Gender:
    Male
    David,
    The quote from the Vassula document clearly states that there can be no era of peace within history, and in fact the phrase "in millenarian style" actually supports what insearch and myself are saying because it does not reduce the thesis to pure chialism, but opens it up to include other variants of it, so it rules every other option out which is why Pope Benedict said on the plane to Brazil in 2007 "It is clear that simplistic forms of millenarianism promising immediate and real conditions of a just life were mistaken" There is no official document I am aware of that states liberation theology is millenarianism, and of course liberation theology does not speak of a coming of Jesus in the flesh, therefore we can say without doubt that the Church is saying clearly that the condemnation is not just surrounding millenarianism in one purest form, but anything " promising immediate and real conditions of a just life ". We should not expect the CDF to issue documents condemning every single thing. The point is that free will has to taken centre stage in the life of every human until the last day. The Book of Revelation cannot be reduced to a series of visions that happen in chronological order. It is a symbolic book which relates the continual struggle of the forces of good and evil which are repeated throughout history in an ever increasing way. In Pope Benedict's book Light of the World, he is asked about the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart and the Pope says clearly he does not expect a sudden turn around in history-and says praying for the Triumph is equivalent in meaning to praying for the Coming of the Kingdom-therefore placing absolutely the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart as the final victory of Jesus at His second coming (which is what St. Louis de Montfort spoke of). This is the misunderstanding of all proponents of the millenium theory. Pope John Paul stated to Brazilian bishops in 1996"Since the beginning of my Pontificate, I have invited the universal Church to turn her gaze to the advent of the third millennium.… I also had the opportunity to point out that this is not “to indulge in a new millenarianism” (Tertio millennio adveniente, n. 23), with the temptation to predict substantial changes in it in the life of society as a whole and of every individual. Human life will continue, people will continue to learn about successes and failures, moments of glory and stages of decay, and Christ our Lord always will, until the end of time, be the only source of salvation."
    What I dont understand is why is there this fixation with the millennium anyway? I mean surely we should be looking forward with joy to our ultimate liberation when our bodies will resemble the Lord's resurrected Body. That is why we pray "Come Lord Jesus"
    www.divinemercypopes.com
     
    insearch likes this.
  10. Fatima

    Fatima Guest

    David, if you read my post carefully, I said the Communist leadership is inherently evil, and it has been since its conception. Of course the people are not inheretantly evil...... that would be absured. You will soon see that Communism is not dead, but a sleeping giant ready to regain its presense. This time it will give no meaning world wide and the fullfillment of the Fatima prophecy that they will innihalate nations and the Holy Father will have much to suffer. JPII getting shot on the feast of Fatima was just a precursor to what the Fatima messages foretold.
     
  11. David Wilson

    David Wilson Guest

    Stephen,

    The Vassula document says "in Millenarian style". Millenarianism is a heresy. The "era of peace" is not a heresy. Millenarianism (or Chiliasm, or any other of its modified forms) includes specific things that were condemned. The possibility of an era or period of peace was never condemned. If you are aware of language from a Church document that has condemned an era or period of peace within history, then I would like to see the specific language. I can find no such document.

    The era or period of peace is not the same thing as the Last Judgement or the Fulfillment of the Kingdom. We are called to live in Peace with ourselves, each other, and nature right now. Many people are living in Peace right now. Many others are living in sin and discord. It is a free choice everyone makes daily. Christ is the Prince of Peace and in fact COMMANDS us to live in Peace, right now.
     
  12. stephen

    stephen Angels

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2013
    Messages:
    212
    Gender:
    Male
    David,
    I am not quite sure how you can ignore what I have written in the above post from the popes because they clearly rule out any type of era of peace before the end of the world.
    Also I am a pianist, and sometimes I play pieces in a neo romantic style, meaning (for those readers who are not musicians) a modern composition that is styled upon the 19th century romantic tradition. Now to link that to "in millenarian style" it means a theory which is based or styled upon an expectation of an era of universal peace and prosperity . Therefore what the CDF is saying is it is a doctrinal error to expect any era of peace. That is the document you are looking for.It couldnt be any clearer. And prove my point, Vassula Ryden had correspondance with the CDF in which she was asked about this matter and she tried to claim it was not milleniarianism in its purest form, and yet even after the correspondance was complete, the vatican did not change its stance on the notification so either way- pure chiliasm or a temporal Kingdom its a doctrinal error.
    Those quotes I used are from the papal magisterium and we know the popes are the guardian of truth. Lumen Gentium tells us we are to submit to the teachings of the Roman Pontiff.
     
    insearch likes this.
  13. insearch

    insearch Angels

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2013
    Messages:
    438
    Gender:
    Female
    David, your absolutely unrealistic view of Russia and it's evils ( yes, inherent, centuries long) just show that you have no idea what is going on there, have never been there more than for a tourist visit and are projecting American view on concience, law and relations between individual and state on the world which is totally different.

    Russia was, is and will be( in the projected future) the inherent threat to the free world - it is it's nature and ideology of the messianic Third Rome, which has been there starting from 14 th century and has never been put aside.

    I am writing from the phone, so can' t provide any links, but your idealistic view of Russian policies is obvious by your absolute ignorance about abortion rate in that country - 53 abortions per 1000 women when in the US it is 20 per 1000! Even in the neighbouring Ukraine which is also post soviet country it is 27 per 1000 - and it also differs there by region of influence - the west, which is west oriented and religious ( not orthodox mostly) is much lower and the east and south which is Russia oriented and mostly atheistic, is much higher, but it is still lower two fold than in Russia!

    Maybe before claiming that Russia is so much better than the West it would be advisable to learn some statistics?
     
  14. "Quis ut Deus"

    "Quis ut Deus" ADMIN Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2013
    Messages:
    4,274
    Gender:
    Male
    Excuse my ignorance here as most of the thread is well above my intelligence but I have noticed in a few quotes the name vassula could you explain what this refers to.
    Thanks John
     
  15. insearch

    insearch Angels

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2013
    Messages:
    438
    Gender:
    Female
    here are some abortions statistics:

    http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_abo-health-abortions

    The population of Russia is ~140 million people, more than twice LESS than that of the US, yet they perform more than TWICE as much abortions as does the US - this alone is just astonishing statistics!


    http://data.un.org/Data.aspx?d=GenderStat&f=inID:12
    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/abortion/russia/ab-rusreg2.html
    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/abortion/ukraine/ab-ukraineo.html
    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/abortion/ab-unitedstates.html
    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/abortion/#UR

    the only restriction which Russia ( and all Eastern Europe) has on abortion vs the US is that it is illegal post 12 weeks - but that is mostly not because anybody values human life that much, but becasue it is simlpy much more dangerous and complicated after 12 weeks, so to avoid morbidity and mortality connected with post-first trimester abortions, the states have plain outlawed it ( which I agree).
     
  16. Jon

    Jon Archangels

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2013
    Messages:
    627
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA - Wisconsin
    Coincidentally, Mark Mallet just laid out the arguments for this the other day on his blog in an open "letter" to Pope Francis. It is too long to copy & paste here, but I think he fully describes the idea that David is trying to convey:

    http://www.markmallett.com/blog/dear-holy-father-he-is-coming/#more-10951
     
  17. Fatima

    Fatima Guest

    David, here is yet another warining (only a few days old) by our Blessed Mother through Pedro Regis www.pedroregis.com on Russia. It's translation is through Google, so is not the best, but it provides us a good reference.

    3810-Our Lady's Message, broadcast on North Wansbeck / DF. transmitted in 04/23/2013Dear children, I love you. And walk with this certainty always full of hope. Tomorrow will be better for the men and women of faith. I ask you to keep the flame of faith. Give to God what is God's. You are in the world but not of the world. Humanity has gotten away from its Creator. Selfishness took the man to a sad spiritual blindness. Return to Him who is your all. Do not live in sin. Is the opportune time for your return. Amai. Love is stronger than death. Love conquers all. Open your hearts and accept God's love. When you happen to fall, do not be discouraged. My Jesus is the Good Shepherd. He will rise up and will take you in his arms. It was for you that My Jesus died on the cross. He opened heaven for you. Courage. Nothing or no one is lost. Bend your knees in prayer. Russia will make an agreement that will bring suffering and death to many of My poor children. Pray, pray, pray. This is the message I give you today in the name of the Holy Trinity. Thank you for permitting Me to reunite you here once more. I bless you in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen alone.
     
  18. mothersuperior7

    mothersuperior7 Powers

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2012
    Messages:
    3,837
    Gender:
    Female
    Albert Pike's letter to Mazzini, dated August 15, 1871:

    • "The First World War must be brought about in order to permit the Illuminati to overthrow the power of the Czars in Russia and of making that country a fortress of atheistic Communism. The divergences caused by the "agentur" (agents) of the Illuminati between the British and Germanic Empires will be used to foment this war. At the end of the war, Communism will be built and used in order to destroy the other governments and in order to weaken the religions."
    • "The Second World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences between the Fascists and the political Zionists. This war must be brought about so that Nazism is destroyed and that the political Zionism be strong enough to institute a sovereign state of Israel in Palestine. During the Second World War, International Communism must become strong enough in order to balance Christendom, which would be then restrained and held in check until the time when we would need it for the final social cataclysm."
    • "The Third World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences caused by the "agentur" of the "Illuminati" between the political Zionists and the leaders of Islamic World. The war must be conducted in such a way that Islam (the Moslem Arabic World) and political Zionism (the State of Israel) mutually destroy each other. Meanwhile the other nations, once more divided on this issue will be constrained to fight to the point of complete physical, moral, spiritual and economical exhaustion…We shall unleash the Nihilists and the atheists, and we shall provoke a formidable social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the effect of absolute atheism, origin of savagery and of the most bloody turmoil.
    • Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity, whose deistic spirits will from that moment be without compass or direction, anxious for an ideal, but without knowing where to render its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out in the public view. This manifestation will result from the general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism, both conquered and exterminated at the same time."
     
  19. insearch

    insearch Angels

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2013
    Messages:
    438
    Gender:
    Female
    And? If one takes into account the Popes words( not Mark's) it is absolutely clear they do not differ at all from the St.Augustine teachings about the Millennium time - we are living NOW and even underline that they do not differ from Church's fathers teachings.

    The pontiffs are not referring to the imminent and definitive coming of the Kingdom of God, which would be a departure from the “living Tradition” of the Church clearly voiced by the Early Church Fathers.



    The Kingdom of God in the Catholic Catechism is unequivocally refereed as one AFTER the Last Judgement :


    2 At the end of time, the Kingdom of God will come in its fullness. After the universal judgment, the righteous will reign for ever with Christ, glorified in body and soul. the universe itself will be renewed:
    The Church . . . will receive her perfection only in the glory of heaven, when will come the time of the renewal of all things. At that time, together with the human race, the universe itself, which is so closely related to man and which attains its destiny through him, will be perfectly re-established in Christ.629
    1043 Sacred Scripture calls this mysterious renewal, which will transform humanity and the world, "new heavens and a new earth."630 It will be the definitive realization of God's plan to bring under a single head "all things in [Christ], things in heaven and things on earth."631


    IN BRIEF
    1051 Every man receives his eternal recompense in his immortal soul from the moment of his death in a particular judgment by Christ, the judge of the living and the dead.
    1052 "We believe that the souls of all who die in Christ's grace . . . are the People of God beyond death. On the day of resurrection, death will be definitively conquered, when these souls will be reunited with their bodies" (Paul VI, CPG # 28).
    1053 "We believe that the multitude of those gathered around Jesus and Mary in Paradise forms the Church of heaven, where in eternal blessedness they see God as he is and where they are also, to various degrees, associated with the holy angels in the divine governance exercised by Christ in glory, by interceding for us and helping our weakness by their fraternal concern" (Paul VI, CPG # 29).
    1054 Those who die in God's grace and friendship imperfectly purified, although they are assured of their eternal salvation, undergo a purification after death, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of God.
    1055 By virtue of the "communion of saints," the Church commends the dead to God's mercy and offers her prayers, especially the holy sacrifice of the Eucharist, on their behalf.
    1056 Following the example of Christ, the Church warns the faithful of the "sad and lamentable reality of eternal death" (GCD 69), also called "hell."
    1057 Hell's principal punishment consists of eternal separation from God in whom alone man can have the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs.
    1058 The Church prays that no one should be lost: "Lord, let me never be parted from you." If it is true that no one can save himself, it is also true that God "desires all men to be saved" ( 1 Tim 2:4), and that for him "all things are possible" ( Mt 19:26).
    1059 "The holy Roman Church firmly believes and confesses that on the Day of Judgment all men will appear in their own bodies before Christ's tribunal to render an account of their own deeds" (Council of Lyons II [1274]: DS 859; cf. DS 1549).
    1060 At the end of time, the Kingdom of God will come in its fullness. Then the just will reign with Christ for ever, glorified in body and soul, and the material universe itself will be transformed. God will then be "all in all" ( 1 Cor 15:28), in eternal life.
     
  20. insearch

    insearch Angels

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2013
    Messages:
    438
    Gender:
    Female
    It is CLEARLY defined that the Kingdom of God is going to be AFTER the LAST judgement - in the Catechism of Catholic Church.
    There is no space for any of the speculations of the PRE - Judgement Kingdom of God (milleniarism, be it standard old-style, or modified Mark mallet - version).

    Neither is there any reference to the PRE-Judgement existence of the Kingdom of God in the Creed - it is pure and simple in it's statements of the fundamental beliefs of the Catholic Church:

    Article 7
    "FROM THENCE HE WILL COME AGAlN TO JUDGE THE LIVING AND THE DEAD"
    I. He Will Come Again in Glory
    Christ already reigns through the Church. . .
    668 "Christ died and lived again, that he might be Lord both of the dead and of the living."548 Christ's Ascension into heaven signifies his participation, in his humanity, in God's power and authority. Jesus Christ is Lord: he possesses all power in heaven and on earth. He is "far above all rule and authority and power and dominion", for the Father "has put all things under his feet."549 Christ is Lord of the cosmos and of history. In him human history and indeed all creation are "set forth" and transcendently fulfilled.550
    669 As Lord, Christ is also head of the Church, which is his Body.551 Taken up to heaven and glorified after he had thus fully accomplished his mission, Christ dwells on earth in his Church. the redemption is the source of the authority that Christ, by virtue of the Holy Spirit, exercises over the Church. "The kingdom of Christ (is) already present in mystery", "on earth, the seed and the beginning of the kingdom".552
    670 Since the Ascension God's plan has entered into its fulfilment. We are already at "the last hour".553 "Already the final age of the world is with us, and the renewal of the world is irrevocably under way; it is even now anticipated in a certain real way, for the Church on earth is endowed already with a sanctity that is real but imperfect."554 Christ's kingdom already manifests its presence through the miraculous signs that attend its proclamation by the Church.555
    . . . until all things are subjected to him
    671 Though already present in his Church, Christ's reign is nevertheless yet to be fulfilled "with power and great glory" by the King's return to earth.556 This reign is still under attack by the evil powers, even though they have been defeated definitively by Christ's Passover.557 Until everything is subject to him, "until there be realized new heavens and a new earth in which justice dwells, the pilgrim Church, in her sacraments and institutions, which belong to this present age, carries the mark of this world which will pass, and she herself takes her place among the creatures which groan and travail yet and await the revelation of the sons of God."558 That is why Christians pray, above all in the Eucharist, to hasten Christ's return by saying to him:559 Maranatha! "Our Lord, come!"560
    672 Before his Ascension Christ affirmed that the hour had not yet come for the glorious establishment of the messianic kingdom awaited by Israel561 which, according to the prophets, was to bring all men the definitive order of justice, love and peace.562 According to the Lord, the present time is the time of the Spirit and of witness, but also a time still marked by "distress" and the trial of evil which does not spare the Church563 and ushers in the struggles of the last days. It is a time of waiting and watching.564
    The glorious advent of Christ, the hope of Israel
    673 Since the Ascension Christ's coming in glory has been imminent,565 even though "it is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has fixed by his own authority."566. This eschatological coming could be accomplished at any moment, even if both it and the final trial that will precede it are "delayed".567
    674 The glorious Messiah's coming is suspended at every moment of history until his recognition by "all Israel", for "a hardening has come upon part of Israel" in their "unbelief" toward Jesus.568 St. Peter says to the Jews of Jerusalem after Pentecost: "Repent therefore, and turn again, that your sins may be blotted out, that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, and that he may send the Christ appointed for you, Jesus, whom heaven must receive until the time for establishing all that God spoke by the mouth of his holy prophets from of old."569 St. Paul echoes him: "For if their rejection means the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead?"570 The "full inclusion" of the Jews in the Messiah's salvation, in the wake of "the full number of the Gentiles",571 will enable the People of God to achieve "the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ", in which "God may be all in all".572
    The Church's ultimate trial
    675 Before Christ's second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers.573 The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth574 will unveil the "mystery of iniquity" in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth. the supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist, a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of his Messiah come in the flesh.575
    676 The Antichrist's deception already begins to take shape in the world every time the claim is made to realize within history that messianic hope which can only be realized beyond history through the eschatological judgement. the Church has rejected even modified forms of this falsification of the kingdom to come under the name of millenarianism,576 especially the "intrinsically perverse" political form of a secular messianism.577
    677 The Church will enter the glory of the kingdom only through this final Passover, when she will follow her Lord in his death and Resurrection.578 The kingdom will be fulfilled, then, not by a historic triumph of the Church through a progressive ascendancy, but only by God's victory over the final unleashing of evil, which will cause his Bride to come down from heaven.579 God's triumph over the revolt of evil will take the form of the Last Judgement after the final cosmic upheaval of this passing world.580

    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P1V.HTM


    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P2Q.HTM#-1CK
     

Share This Page