Mac, can you define millenarianism? Because I am sure that your definition is not in line with what Catholic teaching with imprimatur is stating either. But I know how popular it is to spill this word millenarianism as if faithful Catholics, including Church Fathers writings on this subject, are speaking of a literal return of Jesus in the flesh. At least you can be intellectually honest to give your self some credibility on discussing this subject, by clearly defining what you mean.
Dcana, the timeline you listed in your original post is most likely close to the mark. Much error is being sown now to deceive the faithful through "seers" and "prophets". Many of these "visionaries" may have good will, but they are being deceived. Millenarianism is a heresy. There will be no 1,000 years of peace in the future. That is not how the Church has interpreted the thousand years for us. It has interpreted the "1,000 years" in the Book of Revelation as the Reign of the Church on Earth between Christ's First and Second Comings. It is not meant as a literal thousand years. The term thousand is simply used to denote a long period of time. That is official Church teaching. Anyone who preaches something different is in error. The thousand years is this: As the Creed infallibly teaches, the Second Coming is associated with the end of the world and the Last Judgment. Therefore, it is NOT associated with any earlier time - such as to establish a "Millennium." The Catholic Church specifically condemns "millenarianism," according to which Jesus will establish a throne in this world and reign here for a thousand years [CCC 676]. She teaches instead that Jesus already reigns in eternity (1 Cor. 15:24-27, Rev. 4 & 5) and that in this world His reign, established as a seed, is found already in the Church [CCC 668-669]. This is the 1000 years, which is the Hebrew way of indicating an indefinite long time - in this case, the time between the first and second comings, the era of the Church, in other words the last days in the broadest sense. The Book of Revelation situates this era between the persecutions of the Roman antichrists of the first century and the final unleashing of evil at the end. More at this link: https://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/endtimes.htm
THE MILLENIUM ERROR The Millenium error telescopes the Day of the Lord and the reign of Antichrist into one event and turns the Great Peace, which should separate them, into a 1000 year reign of raptured saints awaiting the Final Judgment. This error may have occurred primarily by way of a misinterpretation of Apocalypse 20:1-11, which is a summary of the whole age of Christ, from His first to His last coming that comes near the end of the book of the Apocalypse: According to St. Augustine, the “first resurrection” is of the souls being saved just after their death. These will wait with Christ until the Final Judgment when they will be reunited with their bodies, which is the “second resurrection.” The “first death” is that of the body, but the “second death” is that of the damned soul. St. Augustine states that the “1000 years” is a number symbolic of a long time, alluding to the time between the first advent of Christ, when the devil was “chained” (lessened and restrained) until the end times when he is unchained for a short time to seduce the nations. In other words, as we write, the “millennium” has passed, and Satan is now unchained. Satan himself and all Hell are now on earth, since 1940 according to some prophecies. He will be fully chained again during the Peace and then fully unchained one more time during the 3 ½ year reign of Antichrist. The Peace will last only 25 years, according to the prophecy of Our Lady of La Salette, not 1000 years. Those who “reign with Christ a thousand years,” according to St. Augustine, are the souls of the elect who have died since the first Advent. They reign in Heaven with Christ awaiting the redemption of their bodies and complete happiness of body and soul at the Final Resurrection. “But we look for new (read: “ renewed”) heavens and a new earth according to his promise in which justice dwelleth” (II Peter 3:13) Here the Peace is indicated. It is not the heavenly Jerusalem descending at the end of time in Apocalypse 21, 22. It is not an ethereal paradise of the saved where “we be always with the Lord” (I Thessalonians 4:16) For after the Peace most of the world will fall to Antichrist. By erroneously combining the references to the final resurrection in I Thessalonians 4 and other such passages with those of the Rapture in Matthew 24 as referring to one event, an idea arose of the earthly reign of immortal saints enjoying heavenly paradisiacal bliss after a rapture. Combine this error of a paradise of the saved on earth with a literal interpretation of the 1000 year reign in Apocalypse, chapter 20, and the millenarian error is completed. Once again it is helpful to see that Apocalypse chapter 20 is a quick, general summary of all Christian history, ending in the Last Judgment. In Apocalypse 20:7-11, the surrounding of the camp of the saints by Gog and Magog who have seduced the nations, and God’s destruction of those forces is a Summary of the Tribulation/Chastisement. But trying to make these lines into Russia attacking the modern secular State of Israel is obviously stretching the context. It involves a misinterpretation of “Israel” as a Jewish State, instead of as the Scriptural intention, the Church, the Mystical Body of Christ -- which the People of God (Israel) became upon Christ’s death in as much as they accepted Him as their Messiah.
Yes, 1,000 years means a very long and unspecified length of time. What is the "restrainer" for if it isn't already restraining Satan from doing his worst? And isn't God's will being done on earth every time Holy Mass is offered or when someone feeds the hungry, tends to the sick, etc? We know that the weeds will grow alongside the wheat until the end of time. I have heard knowledgeable, orthodox Catholics talk of a second Pentecost. Although not certain, I believe they are talking about the era of peace which will enable the Gospel to be preached to the ends of the earth. I think (and am open to correction) that the era of peace is expected to follow the minor chastisement and is expected to last for decades rather than a millennium. Some people say that Holy Mass is the restrainer and that it will be lifted when Mass is no longer offered from the rising of the sun to its setting - a scenario likely to happen during the great apostasy which will lead to the time of the AC. I can't provide links to where I have read or heard this but it's something I have gleaned through watching and reading various Catholic sources. Frances Hogan mentioned the second Pentecost in one of her talks on St. Matthew's Gospel. We Catholics in the West have had it easy and tend to be rather self-centred in our belief that if our countries are apostatizing it must be the same around the world. People who have never heard the Gospel cannot apostatize from a faith they never had. The faith is growing in Africa and Asia although not as fast as we would wish. Perhaps the minor chastisement will speed things up.
There are also approved prophecies that state that the Great Monarch and the antichrist will live during the same time period. With the Great Monarch spanning the time of Chastisement and afterwards into the Period of Peace granted mankind. Then the antichrist rises to power as the power of the Great Monarch wanes. It would seem that the Period of Peace is most likely not an extended period. Perhaps several decades at most. That is of course if we take these prophecies literally. If they are symbolic then the "Great Monarch" might reference his entire lineage and at some point the lineage will end and the antichrist rises. I think however the prophecies taken in context appear to be factual statements rather than metaphors. Additionally the "Period of Peace" might not be that wonderful to live through. We have been told the living will envy the dead. It might just be an absence of war. Similar perhaps to Europe after World War II. Everything was shattered. It was only through the Marshall Plan and the United States having a relatively healthy and untouched economy that allowed it to pour massive amounts of money and resources into the rebuilding of Europe. After the next war there will likely be no country left untouched to do the rebuilding.
Father Gobbi's Blue Book with double Imprimatur (1000' of priest, bishop and cardinals around the world are members of the Marian Movement of Priests MMP) The New Era #453 August 15, 1991 on the Feast of the Assumption into Heaven "The new era, which I announce to you, coincides with the complete fulfillment of the divine will, so that at last there is coming about that which Jesus taught you to ask for, from the Heavenly Father: "Your will be done on earth as it is in heaven". This the time when the divine will of the Father, of the Son and of the Holy Spirit is being accomplished by the creatures. From the perfect fulfillment of the divine will, the whole world is becoming renewed, because God finds there, as it were, his new garden of Eden, where He can dwell in loving companionship with his creatures. The new era, which is just now beginning, brings you to a full communion of life with those who have preceded you and who, here in paradise, enjoy perfect happiness. You see the splendor of the heavenly hierarchy; you communicate with the saints of paradise, you relieve the purifying sufferings of the souls who are still in purgatory. You experience, in a strong and visible way, the consoling truth of the communion of saints. The new era, which I am preparing for you, coincides with the defeat of Satan and of his universal reign. All his power is destroyed. He is bound, with all the wicked spirits, and shut up in hell from which he will not be able to get out to do harm in the world. Herein, Christ reigns in the splendor of his glorified body, and the Immaculate Heart of your heavenly Mother triumphs in the light of her body, assumed into the glory of paradise. This feast of mine, which bids you to look to your heavenly Mother, assumed into heaven, thus becomes for you a reason for deep joy and greatest confidence. In the midst of the innumerable sufferings of the times through which you are living, you look upon me as a sign of sure hope and consolation, because I am the luminous door which opens upon the new era that has been prepared for you by the Most Holy Trinity."
DeGaulle, Father Murray spoke about this in the following World Over segment from 4/12/18. You are correct, "All truth derives from God. All idols derive from the devil. Our Lord is the Way, the Truth and the Life." Please go to @15 min. mark.
I think Fr Gobbi was a false messenger...https://www.catholicdoors.com/isit/isit01.htm And an Imprimatur in recent times doesnt really mean as much as it use to. You do believe in this.......MANY CARDINALS, MANY BISHOPS, AND MANY PRIESTS ARE ON THE PATH OF PERDITION AND THEY TAKE MANY SOULS WITH THEM.
Wow I just read the whole link It sounds exactly like the false and condemned apparitions at Bayside instead of Veronica Lueken we have Fr Gobbi
Yes pretty sad. It was one thing for the faithful to be caught up in his locutions back in the day. But that there are still folks promoting this mess in 2018 is inexcusable.
'promoting this mess is inexcusable'.....those are very uncharitable words! You have some nerve writing that. Pope Benedict said that upon hearing of Father Gobbi's death, that he went straight to heaven. The 'Catholic Doors' article you linked to seems to imply that the Church needs no restoration, that all is well in the Church........not.
Someone can be a good and holy person and be wrong. To my knowledge Fr. Gobbi was a good man. The fact is though that he was mistaken about things. Predictions he made did not happen. We know this to be true. We are in an age of diabolical disorientation. It stretches even to the papacy. Why would we think a priest or lay person might not be susceptible to it? There is a reason that thousands of prophecies from approved sources such as saints and blesseds have been consistent for 2,000 years. It is only some of the "modern" seers who are at variance with that and with each other. If people want to study modern seers that is their right, but I think they should have a very strong knowledge and understanding of what approved prophecy says before they even wade into those waters so they can spot the errors. Personally I know the world and the Church began going off the rails after 1960 so I mostly put my faith in the prophecies that came before that point in time with rare exception. There are a few things that came after that time that I put stock in such as Akita, but only because it is backed by many proven miracles. How many proven miracles accompany today's "seers"?
There are hundreds of messages from the Blessed Mother that speak of the times we live in. There is no way I would toss these messages aside. Just last year 656 priests, a Cardinal and 38 Archbishops and Bishops in addition to 82,000 faithful gathered in Marian Movement of Priests cenacles throughout the world to pray and be strengthened for the times at hand. Yet, you arrogantly proclaim these messages of no value. Would you judge the words of scripture so harshly? What would you make of Revelation 1:3? Blessed is he, that readeth and heareth the words of this prophecy; and keepeth those things which are written in it; for the time is at hand. John wrote 2000 years ago that the time is at hand for the prophecy and here we are in 2018 contemplating what we should expect next. Only God knows.
There are 400 Catholic cardinals/bishops and 10,000 Catholic priests members of the MMP devoted to our Lady and faithful to Catholic teaching and you want to put the boot into them! Nice one Mac. No one is safe from Mac the Knife! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marian_Movement_of_Priests
I've just been called uncharitable and arrogant.Now I have out the knife. I dont think Cardinal Burke is feeling the support of 400 Cardinals and Bishops at this time.
Mac the Knife is my favourite song of all times especially the version sung by Bobby Darin. The Church has not condemned Fr Gobbi! Yet you have!
You have it the wrong way round. One should only commit, if at all, to private prophecy that the Church has positively approved, rather than that which She has not condemned. If one decides to commit to unapproved prophecy, one is taking upon oneself the authority to approve it, an authority which only the Church possesses (I'm not talking about speculation or observation, but starting to bet one's house upon these things).
