CONCERNING OBJECTIONS TO CHURCH'S TEACHING ON RECEPTION OF HOLY COMMUNION BY DIVORCED AND REMARRIED

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And for a minute I thought you were serious. Fool me twice, shame on me. I'm out.

P.S. The souls here are under the protection of the Blessed Virgin Mary, I suggest you go play elsewhere.

 

Thank you for your recent posts Ed. I know a lot of thought and effort went into them. There are some very wonderful thoughts in there.

 

Time for Padraig.


View attachment 6897

Right off the forum.

 

I don't know, I think Ed should be allowed to stay

 

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Only if Ed promises to behave.

 

Jesus taught us to say Our Father.

Two of the greatest words we can utter.

So calling God our Father is not a problem.

Perhaps, you should go and start your own forum where you can confuse people further with your speculative theology. But we wont't accept heretics here.

 

Jesus asked us when praying to call God our "Father "in heaven.
When Jesus made that request he was speaking as a human being.
Indicating to us the universal Fatherhood of the 1 st person of the Trinity.

However this was then hijacked by artists to portray God , the 1 st person of the Trinity as an old bearded man in the sky.
That is actually a huge mistake.
God, the 1 st person of the Holy Trinity is not is not an old man in the sky and is not a human being.

 

I am not a heretic.
Heretics are people who think that God, the first person of the Holy Trinity is an ancient bearded man in the sky .
When Jesus asked people to address God as the Father, Jesus was speaking purely in His human capacity as a person.
This was to help people to understand the universal Fatherhood of the 1 st person of the Trinity.

Only a heretic thinks that the 1 st Person of the Blessed Trinity is a human being.

 

Yes indeed you are right.
However I have been accused of heresy and feel I should defend my position which is in my view completely orthodox and in accordance with church teaching.
Speculation on the nature of the Holy Trinity is at the heart of the Christian life.
This is what the Christian will meet after death therefore some preparatory work is surely in order.

The biggest problem confronting many Christians is the confusion surrounding the nature of the 1 st Person and this confusion is compounded by the multiple references to the First Person as He and Father.
"He "and "Father" are entirely human concepts.
When Jesus asked people to pray the our Father He was speaking in a restricted human capacity .

The First Person of the Blessed Holy Trinity is not a human being.
Therefore references to that Person as "Father " or "He " need to be carefully considered and placed in the proper spiritual context.

 

When God the Father showed himself to Daniel in scripture, He had clothing of white and hair that was white. I think that may be why we all picture him as a wise old man. He speaks with a masculine voice all through the bible. I do not think it is wrong to have this idea. It is with childlike trust that we picture Him this way as it is the way He chose to show himself to His little children.

 

Do you accept the dogma of the Holy Trinity?
The only human in that arrangement is Jesus Christ the man.

The others are not human beings nor is the 2nd person of the Trinity a human being.
The 2 nd person is united with humanity in the person of Jesus but retains full divinity which is not human.
That is the mystery of the Hypostatic Union.

Reducing God to human being status is the great heresy of the contemporary catholic world .

 

Just what is your problem?
Do you really think that the Blessed Virgin Mary wants souls to view the First Person of the Blessed Trinity as a mere human being?
Do you really think she wants souls to view her Son as a mere human being?

 

Anthony, you must go and say many rosaries.......That would make the crooked way straight.

 

Anthony, all of your aguments have already been settled by the Church, so rather then reinvent the truth of the nature of Jesus, listen to what the Church has already clearly defined on the subject.

ARIANISM. A fourth-century heresy that denied the divinity of Jesus Christ. Its author was Arius (256-336), a priest of Alexandria, who in 318 began to teach the doctrine that now bears his name. According to Arius there are not three distinct persons in God, co-eternal and equal in all things, but only one person, the Father. The Son is only a creature, made out of nothing, like all other created beings. He may be called God but only by an extension of language, as the first and greatest person chosen to be divine intermediary in the creation and redemption of the world.

In the Arian system, the logos or word of God is not eternal. There was a time when he did not exist. He is not a son by nature, but merely by grace and adoption. God adopted him in prevision of his merits, since he might have sinned but did not. In a word, instead of being God he is a kind of demiurge who advanced in virtue and merit and thus came to be closely associated with the Father. But his nature is not of the same substance as the Father’s.

Boldly anti-Trinitarian, Arianism struck at the foundations of Christianity by reducing the Incarnation to a figure of speech. If the logos was created and not divine, God did not become man or redeem the world, and all the consequent mysteries of the faith are dissolved.

The First Council of Nicaea was convoked in 325 to meet the Arian crisis. Since the signature lists are defective, the exact number of prelates who attended the council is not known. However, at least two hundred twenty bishops, mostly from the East but also from Africa, Spain, Gaul, and Italy, signed the creed that affirmed the divinity of Christ and condemned Arius as a heretic. “We believe,” the formula read, “in one God, the Father Almighty, Creator of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the only-begotten of the Father, that is, of the substance of the Father; God from God, light from light, true God from true God; begotten, not created, consubstantial [Greek Homo ousion] with the Father.” The soul of the council was St. Athanasius (296-373), Bishop of Alexandria, whose resolute character and theological insight were the main obstacle to the triumph of Arianism in the East.

Since the fifth century, Arian churches have remained in existence in many countries, although some of them were absorbed by Islam. A principal tenet of these churches is the recognition of Christ as Messiah but denial that he is the natural Son of God.

Modern Catholic Dictionary
by Fr. John A. Hardon, S.J.

 

I was just saying to picture Him this way is not wrong. I of course believe He is much more. I picture angels with wings even though I know they do not have them or need them. They show themselves to us sometimes this way and that is why. I also do not think the Holy Spirit is just a dove. You may have taken me too literally.

 

I think trying to form any image of the Holy Trinity will always fall short because a finite human simply can not picture the immense reality of that Infinite Truth and Beauty.
My personal view for what's it's worth is to try see 3,non human Persons actively and separately wielding the power of God. This is then mediated to humanity exclusively through the Person of Jesus Christ in the sacraments of the Catholic Church.
Most of the Holy Trinitys work is obscured to us and that is as it should be.
I am sorry if you think I took you too literally but to my mind the Holy Trinity is the primary mystery of the catholic faith and a very neglected one in my view.

 

Fatima.
I am not arguing anything at all.
I'm simply discussing the nature of the Holy Trinity.
I believe everybody has some insight into this mystery.
If people get het up about discussing such matters then it means they do not have a developed mature Catholicism .
Do you think God sits up there happy that people aware of the Trinity refuse to discuss what it is or what it might be?

Anyway let's put this thread back on topic.
I apologise for any digression I may have caused.

The issue is the heretical proposals in Amoris Laetitiae inspired by the, in my view , formally heretical Cardinal Kasper.
These proposals and the persons pushing them are causing schism in the church.

 

So far you have presumed to tell us how you think the BVM wants us to view the Trinity
And now you are speculating on how God feels
Somehow I feel repulsed
And tired of it all
Too much

 

Really?
If you don't see either God or the Blessed Virgin Mary as your friend then I can only suggest you have a lot of work to do.

 

I'm gone