Coming schism in the Church?

Yes, this is my feeling too.

 

I think you are on the right track Padraig. It is not our job to prejudge the Pope. It is our job however as faithful Catholics to help guard the truths of the Catholic Church from whoever tries to attack them. We are told from prophecy that the attack at this time will come from within the Church from the highest levels. I think we are heading into the most confusing and difficult battle the Church has ever been through. One which even the elect will be fooled by.

Padraig is right to point out that there have been many scoundrel Popes. We have been blessed the past few hundred years with many very holy ones. Personally I worry that it may be something much worse than that. I don't think the Pope is a scoundrel. I do think it is possible though that he may become diabolically confused as we are also warned about. Remember if we have 10 demons sitting on our back, he has a million. If the devil can confuse us here on the forum, how much more could he confuse those who he is launching his all out assault on, the Church hierarchy.

The devil has spent centuries putting this attack plan into action. I think he will attack the Church in such a way that the promise of the Holy Spirit is not broken. That Pope and the Magisterium will never officially teach heresy, but the practice will change. You will still be able to pick up a catechism and read what the Church believes but what will be going on in the pews will be something entirely different.

 

Thanks Lynnfiat for the posting. The sermons at this website are the best I have ever heard. I listen to them all the time. They contain authentic Catholic teaching and deal with the issues the Church is currently going through. I encourage everyone to listen to them if they have not yet. Here is another link to the same sermons:
http://www.reginaprophetarum.org/#/

 

I think you are right on with this, Padraig. The Pope can't and won't change doctrine. Our Lord would not allow it to happen, so that is out. BUT, exactly what you are saying could take place - a nod and a wink to those who are wanting to relax the pastoral practice, which in effect changes the doctrine insofar as it is not taken seriously in practice.

That is exactly what could happen, and we still need to stick with the Church in that case, even though it may stink to high Heaven, rather than join some schismatic group which would maintain the correct pastoral practice.

 

Great talk on the end times Apostacy/schism... Truth
Thanks for your post lynnfiat

 

Miker, I think the thing we all need to keep in mind always, through it all, is that we will all be striped of everything and through it all our eyes must remain on Him. No one will go through what is coming our way without loosing it all and when we do we will have everything. Pray always to not loose hope in what the faith teaches and trust in Him to provide all that really matters. The more I listen to the words of this song, the more I am comforted in what really matters.

 

Why are we pre-Judging Pope Francis ?

Some say the Pope will uphold Doctrine on paper, but give a wink wink - meaning do what you want Bishops and Priests.

But this same Pope Francis declared a year of Mecry!

And in this year he made known that a Holy Door of Mercy in every Cathedral and or Shrine will available to the Whole world.

Anyone who walks thru the doors of Mercy will be granted a Plenary Indulgence!

How do we get this Indulgence?

One has to be in a state of Grace to receive partial or Fullness of the Indulgence.

To receive the Full Indulgence, one must be detatched from even venial sin.

So how can Pope Francis go wink wink- aka - yes bishops and priests defy doctrine and dogma(mortal sin) but walk thru the doors of Mercy for removal of temporal punishment for your sins?

Time to re calibrate your compass and or maps you use...

General Quarters General Quarters this not a drill... Sounds I used to live by in the US Navy, to protect and save the Ships Hull from attack.

Come Holy Spirit...Come!

 

Come Holy Spirit, amen.
Are we "judging Pope Francis" or questioning his actions? Two different things I think.

 

I think your assessment is spot on Praetorian.

 

Well here is my tuppence worth. Its nothing to do with scholarly understanding or lofty realms of mysticism. Its just from the heart. And I believe with all my heart that Pope Francis knows exactly what he is doing, what he has been doing and what he will be doing. And as far as my heart can see, its all good. Its all very good. He is putting the heart and mind of Jesus into the heart and mind of Catholics everywhere, clergy and laity alike. He is exercising the authority given to him by Our Lord and God to a degree never seen in the church's history. He putting first everything that Jesus put first. "Has anyone here condemned you? Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more." Like Jesus he is 100% on the side of the poor and oppressed. He us 100% on the side of Truth. 100%on the side of Divine Mercy. 100% on the side of Divine Justice. He is trying to persuade us all to join him in his effort to care for and grow and feed the flock, to feed his sheep and to bring back those who have lost their way. He is trying to show those who have never been on the right road the Way that is Jesus and the Life that His Way promises in eternal and perfect peace happiness and fulfilmen that leads to God's will being done on earth as it is in heaven. He is trying to show the world the true face of Christ and to make us a more welcoming and less critical people, less superior and more humble. He is trying to change the psyche of the Catholic Church or at least help us to become open to such change to a complete metanoia, a complete change of heart and mind, to put on the yolk that Jesus made according to our individual needs, the yolk that in comparison to the ones we put on our shoulders, makes our burden lighter and our work easier. The rulers of Israel over-loaded the Jewish shoulders with regulations. Jesus simplified their lives and released them from the burden of the Law. He took the axe to the roots of legalism. He freed them into the life of His Spirit under the care of His Church and today especially, safe in the arms of Mary. "I alone can still save you from the clamities that lie ahead." (AKITA) God bless Pope Francis.
"Full in the panting heart of Rome, beneath the Apostles' crowning dome, From pilgrims lips that kiss the ground,
Breathes in all tongues one only sound:
God bless the Pope, God bless the Pope, God Bless the Pope: the great, the good."
Salvation is in his hands. God bless Pope Francis. God bless us.

 

Wel please gOD EVERYTHING WILL BE FINE

Well hopefully it will all work out and it'll not come to that. It doesn't do to jump our fences too much before we come to them.

God is in the driving seat.

Pray,

hope..and don't worry.

 

Cardinals and Bishops ahve expressed concerns, untold priests and religious. The Synod was totally split and not the slightest unease? Not a smidgoen of concern? Not even for a second... or the second of second?

I tend to have doubts every now and again about loads of things even to the nature of reality and the existence of God Himself. I find having had doubts and asked questions I can come back to things a lot stronger.

I guess its how God made me. I think there is a real danger of circling the wagons, pulling down the shutters and going into air raid shelter mode.

I am not an air raid shelter kind of person.

If I have doubts and questions to ask I will explore and ask them.

 

That's fine then , good for you Joe. I am afraid myself I am in no mood for handing out blank checks myself..

 

I understand. I do not expect all other Catholics to agree with my sentiments. In the end it is my heart that speaks to me and me alone. I am simply sharing. I too have the usual problems with the challenges to my faith of which you speak. But I have no problem with Pope Francis. My blank cheque is for him any day.

 

Let us not forget that it was Martin Luther's objection to practices of discipline (whether founded or unfounded) that led him to schism with The Catholic Church. And along with the schismatics came a change in doctrine. History bears out that the right course of action is to remain in communion with the Roman Pontiff whether you agree or not with his decisions on discipline.

 

Once again jumping hedges before we come to them. No one , I hope is talking of going out of Communion.

Sufficient unto the day are the worries thereof.

 

By the way did you know that on March 1277 Bishop Tempier of Paris in conjuction with the University of Paris at the instigation of Pope John xxi (our one and only Portugese Pope) condemned Saint Thomas Aquinas, arguably the greatest theologian in the history of the Church, for heresy?
Would you have gone along with this, that St Thomas Aquinas was a heretic?

Things are not always as black and white as they seem:

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/condemnation/

 

I put my neck out (just as well I am an osteopath) and say that Pope Francis is doing his best to prepare us for the approaching Tribulation, Warning and Miracle. In all probability he knows the date of the Miracle passed on from the days of Paul VI. Like us, if the conscience of Francis is in error it will be corrected in The Warning and then if any revision is made in Church practice after the warning we will be sure it is right and proper according to the corrected conscience of the Pope.

 

I hope so. I sure do hope so. No one would be happier than me...

 

Whatever and whenever Pope Francis comes out with his teachings from the Synod, I hope he uses plenty of past quotes and teachings from past councils and papal pronouncements to support his premis whatever that may be. This will be necessary for the faithful to support him henceforth.