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Filial Correction of Pope Francis for multiple heresies

Discussion in 'Church Critique' started by BrianK, Sep 24, 2017.

  1. Ed Kleese

    Ed Kleese Servant

    Filial Correction of myself and apology to Anthony and Forum Members

    A wise Priest once spoke at a retreat that I was attending, and he said that the satan could just as easily attack us in our perceived strength as in our weakness. He advised that the means to beat him was (through Christ) to allow our weakness to become our greatest strength. This is how Jesus confounded the satan in His death on the cross (not saying Jesus had a weakness, just that satan saw that as a weakness), and now I have some dying to myself to due also.

    I apologize to you Anthony for saying and implying some uncharitable things and I ask your forgiveness my Brother in Christ. You asked me in my one post what my problem was. That got me to thinking and it ends up that I am guilty of some of the very things that I was accusing you of. That is my problem.

    I said that you were not serious, I believe now that you probably are. I said that all of the members here are protected by the Blessed Virgin Mary. While that is true, so are you (through Christ and the Holy Spirit) and She is just as much your Mother as mine. I said to take your games somewhere else. I have no authority to say such a thing on this forum and I have no right to judge what you are saying. I can heartily disagree with you on some of your ideas, but judging is wrong. I accused you of the sin of pride and of spreading lies here. Again, I can't judge you and my very statement smacked of pride on my part.

    I hope you will accept my apology and I look forward to hearty debate in the future. I may not agree with some of your ideas Anthony, but you have taught me a valuable lesson in charity and humility and I thank you for that. This has weighed on me in prayer the last days and I knew this had to be done.

    May God Bless You and Keep You, and All Forum Members, in His Peace,
  2. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    What a very wonderful post Ed. (y)

    In that spirit I would also like to apologize to Anthony and to any other forum members who were upset or offended by the back and forth that went on. I do not retract any of what I said about Anthony's position on the Pope as his position was a grievous error and error must always be fought, but we must strive to do so in a thoughtful manner. Perhaps at times I got hot under the collar and was less charitable than I should have been in putting forth what the Church teaches on the subject.

    While I am at it I must say I have done the same thing to David, Fallen Saint, Joe Crozier, and perhaps others. I have a bit of an Irish temper and when I get steamed I can sometimes become sarcastic and derogatory, which is nothing more than intellectual pride. Something I have no right to as there are many other thinkers here much more well-equipped than myself. I try to eliminate as much of these types of things from my posts as I can before I post them, but sometimes when there is a lot of fast back and forth posting I do not edit myself well enough. Also my apologies to the silent readers who do not have a voice to express their opinions and may have been offended now or in the past by anything I have said. I am doing my best to share the truth of what the Church teaches, but I am fallible and make mistakes and am prone to my own pride, anger and other weaknesses.
  3. BrianK

    BrianK Resident Kook, Crank, Curmudgeon - & Mod Staff Member

    Yes, thank you Ed.

    “Truth before Unity. Charity in Truth.”
    Carol55, gracia, Ed Kleese and 5 others like this.
  4. Dean

    Dean Archangels

    Dang Ed... Way to make me feel like an arse :confused::confused::LOL::LOL:.

    The only thing there I am not sure about is the judging part. While we cannot judge salvation, i do think we can judge actions
    Seagrace and Ed Kleese like this.
  5. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    We are definitely allowed to judge actions. What we are not allowed to do is judge a person's inner intent behind those actions.

    So if we see someone steal something we can say to them "You have stolen that and that is wrong".

    What we cannot do is say "I know you stole that because you are just a hateful, evil person".

    The first is not a judgement of the person, but a statement dealing with external facts. The second is a judgement of the person because we presume to know the inner workings of another. That is reserved only to God.

    This is something important to keep in mind when we are talking about others, particularly the Prelates of the Church. Speaking of external actions is one thing, but judging the internal intent behind those actions is another.
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017
    Mary's child, gracia, Sam and 5 others like this.
  6. Shae

    Shae Principalities

    Beautiful post Ed.
  7. AED

    AED Powers

    I once heard a priest say " I have seen thousands of actions but I have never seen a motive behind it". Unless we are told by the person doing the action we cannot know why someone acts as he does. Better not to ever judge motivation. Safest way to go ! cutting someone the benefit of the doubt is always a good first response I think.
    Mary's child, Praetorian and gracia like this.
  8. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Archangels

    I apologize as well for my lack of charity to Anthonys Truth and to Little Voice. I became aggravated and did not handle it well. I am learning. Christ is my Teacher.
    You fellow MOG members are my brothers and sisters. mea culpa, mea maxima culpa
  9. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Archangels

    However, that being said, all, there may have been times in the past where there actually was some deliberate playing going on by some folks who were posting. Maybe. But still, I am responsible for what happens on "my side of the street." I need to keep "my side of the street" clean and united to Jesus by His grace. I can think of possibly a couple of times when we have been played for fools. But I will be judged on my response to that. And maybe sometimes tough love IS what is called for. Just saying. I know there were times when Padraig saw it necessary to give someone the boot. So be it.
    Everyone who posts here has the same responsibility before God.
    Mary's child and AED like this.
  10. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Archangels

    Sometimes people write deliberately inflammatory posts
    Don't forget that
    They are accountable as well
    Mary's child and AED like this.
  11. AED

    AED Powers

    Beautifully said HH although I cannot think of a single time you behaved in a mean or accusatory way. I think everyone here is remarkably kind given the incendiaries we deal with on a daily basis. I see real charity and humility. When the boot is necessary Padraig steps up to the plate. Surgical and clean. I can honestly say I am SO happy to be part of MOG and all of you. This is a wonderful fellowship. A real gift from God.
  12. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Archangels

    Truly, AED
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  13. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    I second that AED. I cannot think of anything at all HH has said that has been in a mean spirit.
    Carol55, Booklady and HeavenlyHosts like this.
  14. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Archangels

    Thanks Praetorian
    I guess my thoughts were not on view in the posts
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  15. Mary's child

    Mary's child Archangels

    I second this comment. Thank you Ed for helping us correct ourselves and seeing that we have our own planks to remove from our eyes. May our heavenly mother help guide me with humility.
    AED, gracia and Booklady like this.
  16. Carol55

    Carol55 Powers


    Cardinal Burke’s visit to relic of the head of St. Thomas More: a “Heads up” to Pope Francis?
    Posted on October 18, 2017 by Steven O'Reilly
    October 17, 2017 – (Steven O’Reilly) – On Sunday, October 15, Cardinal Burke visited St. Dunstan’s in Canterbury, England, according the National Catholic Register (see “Cardinal Burke Venerates Relic of the Head of St. Thomas More” by Edward Pentin). The purpose of the Cardinal’s stop at this parish church was to pray at the site where the head of St. Thomas More is buried. St. Thomas More, once Chancellor of England, was beheaded for opposing King Henry VIII in the dispute over the papal supremacy, the root cause of which centered on Henry’s divorce from Catherine of Aragon – which More opposed.

    Some folks have been rather harsh toward Cardinal Burke and the Dubia Cardinals throughout the Amoris Laetitia controversy, doubting that a formal correction will ever come. As one who has been impatient at times as well on this question, I think it unfair to be so. By acting with necessary and methodical patience over the past year, the Dubia Cardinals will demonstrate that any accusation they acted rashly is a lie. Instead, their patience will stand in favorable contrast to the Pope’s own silence.

    So, what of the formal correction and its timing? Of this I have no inside knowledge, obviously. That said, in my opinion, there is a primary and secondary purpose to the Cardinal Burke’s visit which do hint to us the public formal correction is coming very soon. First, St, Thomas More died for a cause related to the Church’s teaching on marriage – something for which the Dubia Cardinals are fighting. So, at this moment of Church history, it is noteworthy that Cardinal Burke ventured to pray where the head of the great Catholic martyr is buried, seeking – no doubt – the saint’s intercession for his own task. In this sense, the visit was personal.

    What of the secondary purpose? My guess (see here) is the formal correction was hand-delivered to Pope Francis in July or August and that the Pope – consistent to past form – has since refused to acknowledge it or even grant an audience to discuss it. Thus, the secondary purpose is a subtle gesture intended for Pope Francis – who follows the Cardinal’s moves – and its meaning will not be lost on the Pope. That is, given the Pope will not see the Dubia Cardinals in person, they are reduced to sending a public message to him. Therefore, I believe Cardinal Burke’s visit to St. Dunstan’s was – please excuse the pun – something of a “heads up!” to Pope Francis, i.e., ‘Your Holiness, the public formal correction is coming if you continue to remain silent.’ I see this as a last warning to Pope Francis to avert a crisis. My hunch remains that the formal correction is weeks away, not months.

    As I have said before, I certainly hope Pope Francis will heed the corrections and warnings and spare the Church a certain catastrophe. It would be a catastrophe, but I have no doubt the Church would survive it – and emerge stronger. Let us pray Pope Francis remembers the Lord’s words to Peter: “Simon, Simon, behold Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you like wheat. But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and thou being once converted, confirm thy brethren” (Luke 22:31-32).

    Steven O’Reilly is a graduate of the University of Dallas and the Georgia Institute of Technology. He lives near Atlanta with his wife Margaret. He has four children. He has written apologetic articles and is working on a historical-adventure trilogy, set during the time of the Arian crisis. He can be contacted at StevenOReilly@AOL.com.

    UPDATE: 245 Signatories as of 10/15/17, http://www.correctiofilialis.org/signatories/
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  17. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Could this be reminiscent of when Pope Benedict went to the tomb of St. Celestine V and left his pallium there?
    gracia, Mac, Carol55 and 1 other person like this.
  18. Carol55

    Carol55 Powers

    Praetorian, You have a very good memory. http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/201...l-of-clues-leading-up-to-todays-announcement/

    I thought of BrianK when I read the article that I posted because of Brian's current avatar, he saw this connection awhile ago I suppose. Hopefully, no one is beheaded.
    Mary's child, gracia, Mac and 3 others like this.
  19. BrianK

    BrianK Resident Kook, Crank, Curmudgeon - & Mod Staff Member

    Yes, indeed.
  20. Dolours

    Dolours Powers

    I hope it doesn't mean that Cardinal Burke is about to resign.
    Mary's child likes this.

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