I saw three Signs of the Coming Persecution this week all of them from Europe, two of them annoying, one of them potentially HUGE. Thefirst comes in the new Code of Professional Conduct for Irish teachers. Section Four of the Code specifies forbids , 'Discrimination' in that teacehrs must, 'interact' in a way that 'does not discriminate and that promotes equality in relation to gender , marital status , family status, sexual orientation, religion...........' . Whci his just another way of saying that Catholic moral teaching is out the window. Its really interesting that those who promote these things should feel confident to do so in a Catholic country like Ireland were abortion, for instance is still illegal. A real straw in the wind. A second even stronger straw comes form Secualr (or to call a spade a spade, pagan) England comes in the remarkable High Court case involving a Christain Pentecostal e couple, Eunice and Owen Johns. Eunice and John have been fostering children for a long period quite successfully but upon application to supply respite care for a child aged 5 to 10 years old Derby Council found them 'unsuitable', by Social Workers ,despite the fact that there is a desperate need for such foster parents . The key objection of Social Services and the Council is that the John's would breach recent, 'Equality' legislation given their views on homosexuality and Church attendance. The High Court has still to rule in this case, but it doesn't look good. But the real biggy is a csae being brought by four homosexual couples to demand the , 'right' , again under equality legislation to have a , 'Traditional' civil wedding on demand. Thus paving the way for a long standing demand of homosexuals to Church 'weddings'. By excluding same-sex couples from civil marriage, and different-sex couples from civil partnership, the UK government is discriminating on the grounds of sexual orientation, contrary to the human rights act," said Prof Robert Wintemute, professor of human rights law at Kings College London and legal adviser to the couples. "The twin bans violate article 14 (protection against discrimination), article 12 (the right to marry) and article 8 (the right to respect for family life). The rights attached to civil marriage and civil partnership are identical, especially with regard to adoption of children, donor insemination, and surrogacy. There is no longer any justification for excluding same-sex couples from civil marriage and different-sex couples from civil partnership. It's like having separate drinking fountains or beaches for different racial groups, even though the water is the same cf (this link is to an English Liberal paper): http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2010/dec/19/european-court-marriage-civil-partnerships Its ironic but I wonder if , in England it will be the Catholic Bishops who will be the greatest hindrance to this blasphemy or the Islamic Imans. I would my money, very sadlly on the Immans, there's just no way Islam would stand for this. Sadly I am not really sure if I could say the same for the English Catholic Bishops, for their track record of standing up for the Faith is none too good.
We need our Bishops to be holy and saintly in these days because when there are holy bishops then the laity can follow. So we need to pray for our Bishops. When the Bishops are lukewarm then -----
I mentioned this to a Presbyterian lady at work .Bobby and she told me she knew of several Ministers who have retired early over fears for these new laws....
Padriag, Question on the last sign you mention. You state: Is this case for legalizing marriage for same sex couples, or the right for same sex couples to get married in a church? Here in in Massachusetts, we will unfortunately always be known as the first state to legalize gay marriage in the US. That has led to catholic adoption agencies to close down here, since they were then required to consider placing children in the homes of same sex couples. The adoption agencies rightly said this was against the beliefs of the church and would not do so. Faced with being constantly sued for discrimination, the agencies closed down. Legalized same sex marriage also opened the door for adding curriculum to public schools on different families and in a way, normalizing this family structure. The curriculum was added and parents not notified, leading to some publicity and lawsuits. I forget what grade it was added to, but parents were upset and tried to pull their kids out of the class when they found out. The kids that were pulled out of the class were bullied/picked on by the others. In the end, the school system won, with judges ruling the schools need to educate kids on this because it is a part of our state's society, and they don't want kids in these family units to be picked on. I don't think the same sex society has desired to get married in a church with the ceremony conducted by priests, but I'm sure that day will come. Based on the precedents set in the lawsuits of catholic adoption agencies and public schools, I think we know which way the lawsuit would go
Potatosack, When you say 'legalise gay marriage,' do you mean that gay couples actually use a chapel or church? (Pardon my ignorance on this topic) Here in Ireland last summer, civil partnerships were introduced, giving gay couples equal rights as a married couple. Now the lobbyists are shouting for gay marriage. So maybe you can tell me what does it entail, in terms of what defences a Catholic would have, for example in refusing to allow it to take place in a Church etc.
I believe it means in Britain marriage in a Church, Synagoue or Mosque and if a Minister, priest , Rabbi or Imman were to refuse to conduct such a service or to permit it on religious property than they would, legally be guilty of discrimination. Its like the sea coming in they take an inch at a time asking for more and more and more, ever more. I would say the two great bastions thorughout Europe to stop this creeping tide are the Catholic Church and (ironically) Islam. I can't imagine in a million years an Imman permitting this abomination. But I think this is why the Catholic Church has become so hated. They may not like Islam too much either but they have learned to fear it, which shows how cowardly and hypocritical much of the liberal media are, for they see the Church as a soft target.
You know, there are "Catholic" organizations that are trying to integrate gays that are Catholic into the church, and have been doing so for many years. For instance, there is an Archdiocese in Chicago, and an organization in Maryland that gives direction also. http://www.aglochicago.org/ http://www.newwaysministry.org/ Several years ago, before I discovered Medjugorje and began my conversion back to the core faith, and was just a Sunday Catholic who was going mostly for my kids...a young man in our family informed us all that he was gay, and that he was angry at the Catholic Church now because he had to stop being Catholic. Back then, in my attempt to help him, I found this archdiocese in Chicago and told him about it, and that he didn't have to stop being Catholic, that there were alternatives. I honestly thought I was doing the right thing. Well, I understand now of course, this was the wrong answer to give him, but for many, this is their answer now, and other people are trying to help them find a way to be gay and also be Catholic. I have an old friend too (another Catholic), who says he is gay and has left the church. He was a good Catholic when he was younger, and even once thought about the priesthood. But now he has a "partner" and they have been together for 14 years. It is hard not to judge when someone you care about is struggling with these things. I try to be compassionate, but now I have to tell them they are wrong to live that way, and then all I can do is pray for them. Many of these organizations have good intentions, but misguided morals are being propigated. How will God judge someone who believes in their heart that they are gay, lives the lifestyle, and believes that God is ok with that? I sure wish the warning would come so everyone in our modern world would know exactly how God will judge these things. It would help us all so much!!! I pray for the warning to come and enlighten us all - so we can have a leg to stand on against the sinful trends of these times.
Hi Sean, Here in the US, the decision to legalize gay marriage or civil unions is made at the state level. So in Massachusetts and most of the new england states, gay marriage is legal. In Massachusetts, a lesbian couple sued the state, saying they had the right to marry, and the judge agreed. So we citizens did not have a say in it, and have never been allowed to vote on it's legality. It was decided by a judge. Other states allow civil partnerships, but not marriage. Some states have added the question of recognizing gay marriage within the state to their ballots, and the citizens vote on whether they want it legal. So some states may never recognize gay marriage if their citizens voted it down. But even then it does not seem guaranteed. This happend in California, where it was on the ballot twice and both times the citizens of the state voted it down so it could not be made legal, but that is not stopping gay couples from sueing and it is an ongoing battle. How can a judge overturn the will of the people in California? How can a judge in Massachusetts establish a law to recognize gay marriage and never give the people of Massachusetts a voice on the issue? So far everything is at the state level. Bush passed the defense of marriage act, so at the federal level marriage is only recognized between a man and a woman. But I have read that Obama wants to repeal this. It is an ongoing battle here...but I am happy we are still battling!! So, in the states where same sex marriage is legal, there is nothing stopping a gay couple from going to a church and asking a priest to marry them. Based on the precedent already set with catholic adoption agencies, I believe the church would be found guilty of discrimination if they refused to perform the service. So, a gay couple could do this today if they wanted...it is only a matter of time before it will happen. It is a battle. And by the way, the lesbian couple who'se law suit resulted in the legalization of gay marriage in Massachusetts...they are already divorced!!
I see, thanks Potatosack. It's shocking to see how corrupt the system can be, by not including the voice of citizens in a public ballot, for instance.
This is why it is so important to pull kids out of public schools and home school them. I was home schooled, and I think it's the best! My siblings are still being home schooled. Mothers shouldn't think they're unqualified. Thete are other families who can help you, join forces with other families, encourage.grandparents to get involved since they're full of wisdom. My grandma transformed her garage into a school room and we hired tutors to help tje different age groups. First it started out with just our families, then it sprwad to neighbors. It's all Catholic. Now she has three school rooms,: one for Kindergarten, another for 1st-4th and the other for 5th and up. It has been beneficial for everybody.
jmj, Geralyn and I have, and still are, homeschooling our children. Yahoo! St. Thomas Aquinas, pray for us! (If you don't have the brains, go to someone who does! )
My best friend home schools- and I'm envious! So much quality time with the kids. I love the fact that your Grandmother has a school house in her home! Thats great JMJ!
It's worth revisiting this in light of current events. The last Catholic Adoption Agency in England has closed down since it was considered against the law to "discriminate on the ground of sexual orientation". The British Government has just launched a 12 week consultation on allowing gay couples in England and Wales to marry. At the same time Rowan Williams, Archbishop of Canterbury, resigns to take up an academic position at Cambridge University stating his successor was going to need the "constitution of an ox and the skin of a rhinoceros". One has the feeling in such an aggressively secular society that things are only going to get worse. In fact our own bishop is waiting to retire following cancer and our local parish priest intimated that the church is having difficulty trying to fill the position because no one wants the job! One calls to mind Our Lady's constant pleas to pray, pray, pray for her sacred servants.
When the going gets tough, the tough get going. Zechariah 13:9 This third I will bring into the fire; I will refine them like silver and test them like gold. They will call on my name and I will answer them; I will say, 'They are my people,' and they will say, 'The LORD is our God.'"
One of the "good guys"! May 10, 2012: PRESS RELEASE: Father Robert Barron Appointed Rector of Mundelein Seminary today by the Archbishop of Chicago The popular Word on Fire priest will also continue his work with the media group The Archbishop of Chicago, Francis Cardinal George, announced today Father Robert Barron has been appointed Rector-President of Mundelein Seminary/University of St. Mary of the Lake. Father Barron will assume this role in July at the seminary located outside Chicago. "As a priest of Jesus Christ I accept this responsibility with joy," said Father Barron. "The appointment brings together many of the elements that have long been of great importance to me, namely, the priesthood, theological scholarship, pastoral care and evangelization." Barron is currently the Director of Word on Fire Catholic Ministries, a media group he founded to advance the new evangelization. He will continue in this role and its mission, along with his new appointment at Mundelein. Last year, Word on Fire released a 10 part documentary series, Catholicism, which Father Barron created, wrote and hosted. The series aired across the country on PBS and EWTN, and has been seen in parishes, universities and schools throughout the world. The documentary also won a Christopher Award for excellence. “The mission of evangelization will continue to be a priority for me, and Word on Fire is essential to this mission,” said Father Barron. “I will continue to set the ethos for the Word on Fire apostolate and provide new media content to enhance the Church’s outreach to the culture. I remain focused in my commitment to help promote the Catholicism series and study programs as indispensable tools for the new evangelization.” Father Robert Barron, ordained in 1986, is a priest of the Archdiocese of Chicago. He received his Masters’ Degree in Philosophy from the Catholic University of America in 1982 and a doctorate in Sacred Theology from the Institut Catholique in 1992. Barron was appointed to the theological faculty of Mundelein Seminary in 1992 and has also served as a visiting professor at the University of Notre Dame and at the Pontifical University of St. Thomas Aquinas. He was twice scholar in residence at the Pontifical North American College at the Vatican. Father Barron was baptized at Queen of All Saints Basilica in Chicago and grew up at St. John of the Cross Parish in Western Springs, Illinois. He is the author of many books including The Priority of Christ: Towards a Post-Liberal Catholicism, and most recently Catholicism: A Journey to the Heart of the Faith. University of Saint Mary of the Lake, also called Mundelein Seminary, is the principal seminary for the formation of priests in the Roman Catholic Archdiocese of Chicago. It is recognized as the first institution of higher education in the City of Chicago, chartered by the Illinois General Assembly in 1844, and has the longest continuous academic charter in the state. Mundelein is one of the largest seminaries in the United States.
