The Vatican Has Fallen

Discussion in 'Church Critique' started by padraig, Dec 31, 2016.

  1. Julia

    Julia Immaculate Heart of Mary, pray for us.

    Don_D, do not let anyone or anything come between your Faith in Jesus Christ and your love for Him, even if you are not sure what to understand anymore. We are living in the final confrontation between The Christ and the anti Christ. We will all have these moments. Trust in Jesus to bring you through these times. I have stopped reading the debates because they disturb my inner peace, and Jesus is too important to me to let anyone do that.
     
    Don_D and AED like this.
  2. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    http://thefederalist.com/2017/05/30...ancis-asserts-equivalence-islam-christianity/

    In Wake Of Manchester, Pope Francis Asserts Equivalence Between Islam And Christianity

    This pope’s inclination to advance an ideological stance over rational judgment does not bode well for Catholicism or the future of the West. Willful blindness endangers both.

    Maureen Mullarkey

    On the papal flight back to Rome from Fatima, Francis held his customary en passant interview with hand-picked members of the press. Protective of their access, reporters on board are habitually reluctant to question aggressively or press for frankness. The aptly named Fátima Campos Ferreira, of Portuguese Radio and Television, asked the pontiff:

    From this historical standpoint, what remains now for the Church and for the whole world? Also, Fatima has a message of peace, and the Holy Father is going to receive in the Vatican in coming days – on 24 May – the American President Donald Trump. What can the world hope for from this meeting, and what does the Holy Father hope for from this meeting?

    Following the pattern of Marian apparitions at La Salette, France, in 1846, the experiences of the three shepherd children at Fatima, Portugal, in 1917 were apocalyptic in tone. Their visions carried warning of grave peril and called the faithful to heed the urgency of penance. Repentance and reparation were the keynotes that made Fatima a fulcrum of opposition against communism during the Cold War era. Ferreira’s reference to a vaporous “message of peace” was the signal for Francis to deliver a trademark feint. He seized his cue:

    That Fatima has a message of peace, certainly. . . . And I would like to say something which touched my heart. Before leaving, I received some scientists of various religions who were doing research at the Vatican Observatory at Castel Gandolfo. Some were agnostic or atheists. An atheist said to me: ‘I am an atheist’; he didn’t say what nationality he was or where he came from. He spoke in English, so I couldn’t tell and I didn’t ask him. ‘I ask you a favour: tell Christians that they must love Muslims more’. That is a message of peace.

    The Vatican transcript continues:

    Fátima Campos Ferreira

    Is that what you are going to say to Trump?

    Pope Francis

    [smiles]

    Ten days later, a Muslim suicide bomber murdered 22 people and mangled scores more at Manchester Arena. The Vatican released a telegram signed by its secretary of State, Cardinal Pietro Parolin: “His Holiness Pope Francis was deeply saddened to learn of the injury and tragic loss of life caused by the barbaric attack in Manchester, and he expresses his heartfelt solidarity with all those affected by this senseless act of violence.”

    But the violence was not senseless. It was purposeful, a calculated act of Islamic orthodoxy. After the Gaza War in 2009, Yusuf al-Qaradawi summarized the deadly core of Islam with an endorsement of jihad: “Oh, Allah, count their numbers, and kill them down to the very last one.” Al-Qaradawi, an Egyptian, is one of the Muslim world’s most eminent theologians and head of the International Union of Islamic Scholars.

    This Directive Only Seems to Apply One Way
    The pope visited Egypt shortly after the Palm Sunday bombing of two Coptic churches that killed 45 Christians. No record exists of him having told the Egyptians to love Christians more. No one heard him ask them to love Jews more or hold Israel closer. Instead, he asserted “the incompatibility of violence and faith.” It was an affirmation made against all historic evidence and in denial of the nature of Islam.

    Papal condolences, delivered indirectly by telegram to the victims of the Manchester nail bomb, omitted any reference to Islam. The statement took pains to avoid it. Absent any recognition of the true cause of the attack, Francis’ “solidarity” is meaningless. Note that he was “deeply saddened”—not angered, outraged, or even offended. We are saddened when kittens die, or a sick spaniel is put down. But when innocent persons are massacred something more muscular is required. The fatuity of sadness in the face of murder invites the next atrocity.

    If ever there were a time to call down judgment on acolytes of annihilation, this is it. Refusal to name the motive for slaughter comes unnervingly close to the old legal maxim: Silence equals assent. Certainly, Francis does not sanction the violence. Not at all. What he assents to is the multicultural dogma of religious equivalency—the Same God myth—and the lethal fairytale that Islam is not inherently violent.

    These Religious Equivalents Are False and Dangerous
    Since it burst out of the Arabian desert in the seventh century, Islam swept across the known world by terror. It was the blitzkrieg of its age. As Islam reasserts itself (as Hilaire Belloc predicted it would) after the dissolution of the Ottoman Empire, terror is once again its gospel and its weapon. To take the violence out of Islam, Muslims would have to abandon all belief in the Quran as the word of Allah. It would have to reject the warlord Mohammed as his prophet and a model of conduct. In short, Islam would be required to denature itself—something unlikely to happen on the interfaith circuit.

    If ever there were a time for judgment to be called down on acolytes of annihilation, this is it. The Chair of Peter is a high rostrum from which to proclaim the primacy of the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Jesus over the Islamic worldview. Allah, of course, would be displeased. And Francis is hostile to anything that might resemble missionary activity. In a 2014 interview with journalist Pablo Calvo for the Argentine weekly Viva, he said: “The worst thing you can do is religious proselytizing, which paralyzes. No. Each one must dialogue from his own identity.”

    Francis cherishes the fallacy that Western affluence—the unspecified “economy that excludes”—is the incendiary, not Islamic identity:

    Terrorism grows when there are no other options, and when the center of the global economy is the god of money and not the person — men and women — this is already the first terrorism!

    Last July, arriving in France just after a pious Muslim had slit the throat of an elderly priest, the pope intoned: “All religions want peace.” A month later, on the flight home from World Youth Day, he delivered this to the court press:

    I don’t like to speak of Islamic violence, because every day, when I browse the newspapers, I see violence, here in Italy. This one who has murdered his girlfriend, another who has murdered the mother-in-law. And these are baptized Catholics! There are violent Catholics! If I speak of Islamic violence, I must speak of Catholic violence. . . . [Religion] is like a fruit salad; there’s everything. I believe that in pretty much every religion there is always a small group of fundamentalists.

    A logical shambles, the remarks embarrass the Christian church. An Italian who murders his girlfriend—his mother-in-law, his bookie, his dentist—is not under standing orders from God to rid the entire world of their kind. Catholicism did not make him do it. This pope’s inclination to advance an ideological stance over rational judgment does not bode well for Catholicism or the future of the West. Willful blindness endangers both.

    The unspoken name—Islam—withheld from the papal telegram to Manchester parallels Francis’ wordless smile in response to the Portuguese reporter’s in-flight question. It is the smile of oblivion on the face of one of Thomas Ligotti’s demonic clowns.

    Maureen Mullarkey is an artist who writes on art and culture. She keeps the weblog Studio Matters. Follow her on Twitter, @mmletters.
     
    sterph likes this.
  3. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    https://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2017/06/vatican-police-state-pope-wants-to-know.html?m=1#more

    Vatican Police State: Pope wants to know where each Cardinal is at all times
    It's funny how this Pope only wants "tradition" (with a very, very small "t") when it suits his purposes.



    This letter sent by the Dean of the College of Cardinals to the "Resident" Cardinals, that is, those who reside in Rome, was revealed today by the Rome correspondent of The Wall Street Journal, Francis X. Rocca:

    [​IMG]

    DEAN OF THE COLLEGE OF CARDINALS

    From the Vatican, May 31, 2017


    N. 122/2017



    Your Eminence,



    A noble tradition has always led the Fellow Cardinals residing "in Urbe" to inform the Holy Father, by way of the Secretariat of State, the period of their absence from Rome and the address of their stay.


    Pope Francis has recently requested of the Dean of the Cardinalatial College to fraternally remind each single Cardinal the opportunity of keeping that practice, even more so in the case of an extended absence from Rome.

    From my part, I gladly fulfill this venerable assignment, assured of the fullest consideration that it will be given.


    Finally, I take the opportunity to greet you in the Lord and wish you all the best.


    + Angelo Card. Sodano


    ___________

    To the Eminent Lord Cardinals

    resident in Rome

    Maybe he should just lock them up in a prison in Vatican City State and release them only after thorough authorization. Who knows, they may be "conspiring" against him, or even worse, planning what to do in the case of an upcoming conclave -- as Francis' own supporters did long before Benedict XVI ever "thought" of abdicating (or "being abdicated"...)


    [Tip and source: @FrancisXRocca]
     
    Don_D likes this.
  4. Jarg

    Jarg Archangels

  5. Mario

    Mario Powers

    Decentralization?:whistle:

    Safe in the Barque of Peter!
     
  6. Praetorian

    Praetorian Powers

    Maybe it is too offensive.
    We don't want to hurt anyone's feelings.
    (Extreme sarcasm...)
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2017
    AED and sterph like this.
  7. Katfalls

    Katfalls Powers

    C'mon now, get a grip. It says to check with your local diocese for bible readings. Since they are updated to your language etc. I easily found the bible and daily readings and other topics of interest on the bible, and acceptable bible versions on the site of my diocese. Don't make this sound like fake news scandal stories.
     
  8. Jarg

    Jarg Archangels

    Who says this is fake news scandal? This is plain news, as plain as they can be.

    Most catholic dioceses don't have the bible on their website. I can specially speak of the Spanish speaking world, which still amounts for the largest part of he Catholic Church in terms of population. Even in Spain, which is a supposedly developed European country, the Episcopal Conference does not have it on the website. They only have a link that takes you to a ebook website to buy the Bible for €6.99.

    Instead of eliminating it, it would have been better to include the different Catholic Bible versions that exist within each language/episcopal conference (i.e. Spain vs. Peru, or US, UK, Australia).

    Isn't the Church supposed to be all about diversity and access?

    So now, if the Holy See and many Episcopal Conferences don't provide catholics (in the XXI century, the Age of Internet!) free access for the consultation of the bible, who is going to do it?

    It costs close to nothing (in terms of programming maintenance) to have the Bible on vatican.va, why take it down? And why keep all of the other documents of the Church and eliminate the most important one? How is this supposed to help the Church?

    Besides, how is this a way of proclaiming and honoring God's Word in the internet and at the very heart of Church?
     
    sterph and DivineMercy like this.
  9. Carol55

    Carol55 Ave Maria

    Jarg, I have not used the Bible on the Vatican's site, I assume that you have? It is definitely strange to have it available and then take it away. Maybe there is a way to send an email to them and voice your concerns?
     
  10. Fatima

    Fatima Powers

    Even those in the Vatican consider hate speech in the bible, as it pertains to divorce and remarriage, sodomy, fornication, keeping the Lords day holy, etc... so they have to do away with it as well.
     
    BrianK likes this.
  11. Dolours

    Dolours Guest

    Maybe they found the Apostles' tape recorders and are going to amend the text to reflect what Jesus really said or meant.

    Laudate Si is still there in Arabic, English, French, German, Italian, Latin, Polish, Russian, Spanish and what looks like Chinese. Wouldn't do to deprive the faithful of the Church's priority to save the earth now that abolishing sin has taken care of souls. ;)

    The Bible is not available on the website of our Archdiocese.
     
    Pray4peace, AED, BrianK and 1 other person like this.
  12. CrewDog

    CrewDog Guest

    Just "What's the Deal" in Vatican City? PF refuses, it seems to me, a reasonable request to meet four Cardinals about a matter causing much confusion, angst and division in the Church and "goes silent" over a Venezuelan Socialist Dictator who is wreaking havoc in a once prosperous country. I country that PF should be more familiar with than any here. Something be very smelly about ALL of this!!

    "The curious Vatican diplomacy in Venezuela"

    https://cruxnow.com/commentary/2017/06/24/curious-vatican-diplomacy-venezuela/

    GOD SAVE ALL HERE!!
     
    Blizzard and Byron like this.
  13. Jarg

    Jarg Archangels

    I know today the negative news about the Church are in the front page of all news outlets with Cardenal Pell, which we should pray for regardless of whether he is finally convicted or not.

    I was nevertheless petrified by this other dark news coming from infovaticana:

    The police interrupted a gay orgy with drugs in a Vatican apartment inside the 'Santo Oficio.'

    The secretary of Cardinal Coccopalmerio is the occupant of the apartment, which is situated in the CDF offices. The police come in in the middle of a "party" and the priest has been sent to detox. His BMW with Vatican plate had protected him from the police [in previous occassions].


    https://infovaticana.com/2017/06/29/descubren-una-orgia-gay-drogas-apartamento-del-vaticano/
     
  14. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    Essential reading:

    https://whatisupwiththesynod.com/in...game-i-call-it-connect-the-vatican-perv-dots/
     
  15. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    https://rorate-caeli.blogspot.ca/2017/06/de-mattei-francis-imposes.html?m=1

    De Mattei: Francis imposes concelebration in the Priestly Colleges of Rome
    Roberto de Mattei

    Corrispondenza Romana

    June 28, 2017



    [​IMG]

    There is this rumour going around in the Vatican. One of Pope Francis’ collaborators asked him if it were true that a commission had been set up “to re-interpret” Humanae Vitae and he responded “It is not a commission, it’s a study group”. This is not only a linguistic ploy to hide the truth, but a play on words which reveal how the cult of contradiction is the essence of this pontificate. Monsignor Gilfredo Marengo, coordinator of the “study group”, sums up this philosophy well when he says we need to avoid the “polemical game - the pill - yes - the pill - no, just like today’s – Communion to the divorced - yes - Communion to the divorced - no” (Vatican Insider, March 23rd 2017).



    We need this premise to present a new confidential document, it also, the product of another “study group”. It is the “working paper” of the Congregation for the Clergy “On Concelebration in the Colleges and Seminaries of Rome”, which is circulating in an unofficial way in the Roman colleges and seminaries. What emerges clearly from this text is that Pope Francis wants to impose Eucharistic Concelebration in the colleges and seminaries of Rome, de facto, if not in principle, affirming that: “the celebration in community must always be preferred to individual celebration”.


    may concelebrate the Eucharist; they are however, fully entitled to celebrate the Eucharist individually, is obvious and repeated in two passages of the text, with the result that the colleges that apply the “working paper to the letter”, will violate the current universal law. But beyond the juridical considerations, there are others of a theological and spiritual nature.


    On March 5th 2012, on occasion of the presentation of Monsignor Guillaume Derville’s book, Eucharistic Concelebration. From Symbol to Reality. (Wilson & Lafleur, Montréal 2012), Cardinal Antonio Cañizares, the then Prefect of the Congregation for Divine Worship, underlined the need for “moderating” concelebration, making the words of Benedict XVI his own: “I join […] in recommending the daily celebration of Mass, even when the faithful are not present. This recommendation is consistent with the objectively infinite value of every celebration of the Eucharist, and is motivated by the Mass's unique spiritual fruitfulness. If celebrated in a faith-filled and attentive way, Mass is formative in the deepest sense of the word, since it fosters the priest's configuration to Christ and strengthens him in his vocation.” (Apostolic Exhortation, Sacramentum caritatis, n. 80).



    Catholic Doctrine in fact, sees in Holy Mass the unbloody reenactment of the Sacrifice of the Cross. The multiplication of Masses renders greater glory to God and is an immense good for souls. “if every Mass has in itself the same infinite value – writes Father Joseph de Sainte Marie – the dispositions of men to receive its fruits are always imperfect and, in this sense, limited. From here [comes] the importance of the number of celebrations of Masses in order to multiply the fruits of salvation. Sustained by this elementary but sufficient theological reasoning, the redeeming fecundity of the multiplication of Masses is moreover proved by the liturgical practice of the Church and of the stance of the Magisterium. Of this fecundity, the Church – history teaches – has become progressively more aware over the course of the centuries, has promoted the practice of the multiplication of Masses and subsequently has encouraged it officially more and more.” (L’Eucharistie, salut du monde, Dominique Martin Morin, Paris 1982, pp. 457-458)).



    For the neo-modernists, the Mass is reduced to an assembly: the more priests and faithful present, the more significant it is. Concelebration is intended as a means for the Priest to lose slowly the awareness of who he is and what his mission is, which is exclusively the celebration of the Eucharistic Sacrifice and the salvation of souls. The diminution of Masses, however -- as well as the right conception of the Mass -- is one of the main causes for today’s religious crisis.



    Now even the Congregation for the Clergy, at the request of Pope Francis, is making its contribution to the demolition of the Catholic Faith.


    Translation: Contributor Francesca Romana



    Sent from my iPhone
     
  16. Blizzard

    Blizzard thy kingdom come

    The truth of the matter is this pope has always been a staunch supporter of the Maduro regime.
     
    Byron likes this.
  17. davidtlig

    davidtlig Guest

    Perhaps you could give us a just a little bit of evidence to support that statement?

     
  18. Blizzard

    Blizzard thy kingdom come

    Please refer to the article crewdog posted.

    I could find dozens of other articles but I dont have the time right now. And you wouldnt be convinced anyway so why bother.
     
  19. davidtlig

    davidtlig Guest

    Yes, as I suspected, there is no evidence to support the statement and the Crux article certainly doesn't contain any.

    There are two sides to the conflict in Venezuela and Pope Francis is doing his very best to prevent civil war breaking out. This inevitably leads to both sides claiming he is against their side. The situation in Venezuela is truly desperate but will become much worse if civil war breaks out. For Pope Francis to come out speaking against Maduro would definitively stop any chance of the Vatican being able to stop the conflict.

     

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