This with Padre Pio may have happened it may not have happened , who knows? I read another story about Padre Pio which may also be instructive. His Archbishop at that time was a well known child molestor. So bad did he become that after molesting one of his altar boys local people rioted entered his palace and His Lordship had his nose broken . (I wish I had been there to see it) But apparently at the start this Archbishop was very, very much pro Padre Pio and did all that he could to support him. Until that is one day, witnesses report he went into confession with the saint and the saint was heard shouting very loudly at the unfortunate prelate who ran out of the confessional like a scalded cat white as a chicken. ( I would just love to have seen that too). But this, apparently was the point at which the Archbishop turned on Padre Pio and got his friends in the Vatican to do likewise. From then on poor Padre Pio was on borrowed time. Another time Padre Pio had garnered a very large sum of money for his hospital. However the Leaders of his Capuchin Order apparently turned up in a chauffered Limousine and ordered him to hand over the dough. They had become involved with a financial swindler and had lost all their money. Padre Pio refused them point blank saying the money was given for his hospital and they could not steal it. Padre Pio of course had a duty of Obedience to his religious Superiors to whom he had taken a Vow of Obedience. Was he then being disobedient ? Was he breaking his vows? No of course not for he was been asked to do something evil, to steal money, so the saint when with his conscience and chased them with a few harsh words to boot. None of us have a duty to aquiese to evil, in fact we may have a duty to kick ass when confronted by it as the Saint did. You can read about these wonderful events and others in the wonderful book, the best ever by Bernard Ruffin. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Padre-Pio-Story-Lillian-Ruffin/dp/0879736739
The Real Meeting Between Saint Padre Pio and Archbishop Lefebvre What the archbishop wrote about his meeting with Padre Pio From the Society website: On August 8, 1990, Archbishop Lefebvre wrote a personal letter to a Society priest in France who had written to ask him about the meeting with Padre Pio. Here are extracts from the letter: 'For several years now this slander, a fabrication from start to finish, has been circulating in Italy. I have already refuted it, but lies die hard; there is not one word of truth in the page of that magazine you photocopied for me. The meeting which took place after Easter in 1967 lasted two minutes. I was accompanied by Fr. Barbara and a Holy Ghost Brother, Brother Felin. I met Padre Pio in a corridor, on his way to the confessional, being helped by two Capuchins. I told him in a few words the purpose of my visit: for him to bless the Congregation of the Holy Ghost which was due to hold an extraordinary General my Chapter meeting, like all religious societies, under the heading of aggiornamento (up-dating), meeting which I was afraid would lead to trouble... Padre Pio kissing Archbishop Lefebvre's ring. Then Padre Pio cried out. 'Me, bless an archbishop, no, no, it is you who should be blessing me!' And he bowed, to receive the blessing. I blessed him, he kissed my ring and continued on his way to the confessional... That was the whole of the meeting, no more, no less. To invent such an account as you sent me the copy of calls for a satanic imagination and mendacity. The author is a son of the Father of Lies Thank you for giving me the chance to tell once more the plain truth. Most cordially yours in Christo et Maria, +Marcel Lefebvre
In the Spirit of Truth, Grace and Charity Steve, I would like to affirm there was no intent to imply anything on my part in sharing the post about what Saint Pio was purported to have said. I believed it, and having read the link Mac gave us; now realise it must be another false claim about something Saint Pio said. It would appear there are some who support Bishop Lefebvre and the Holy Ghost Fathers reading the threads. I would not want to be associated with any criticism towards those who may support the Traditional Latin Mass and maybe Bishop Lefebvre. I have attended Latin Mass on occasion and miss the Traditional Holy Mass. It was interesting to read of the Franciscans of the Immaculata being still forbidden. I used to support them with Mass stipends until I read they had been stopped or something by the Vatican. And have been afraid to send stipends ever since. I wondered what happened to them or whither they were allowed again, and from reading here, now see they are still on ice so to speak. This makes me very sad, but what can we do but comply if we want to be considered Roman Catholic. I do affirm that public criticism of Holy Father and things attributed to his opinions and sayings outside of Dogma and Doctrine are above my pay grade as a mere servant of the Lord and His Church. And would take the matter up with my confessor in the first instance if I do ever have a need for clarity in the light of our Faith and Traditions. I don't know if that would lead to information sharing in debate afterwards. The occasion has not yet arisen thank God. Be at peace friend. I am glad Mac ( and after my post Padraig also) has been able to inform us of the truth from the Saint Pio article, and maybe that is another blessing this site has been in keeping us on track and informed.
"The greatest charity is to deliver souls held fast by Satan in order to win them over to Christ." Padre Pio
This is true garabandal. But are you aware that if you really want to deliver souls held fast by satan in order to win them over to Christ. It requires SACRIFICE. What is sacrificial about preaching to the converted. I believe a sacrifice is a personal emptying of ones own 'self will' and putting in it's place the Will of God first. And Jesus Christ was and is the first example of what it means to deliver souls held fast by satan. He Sacrificed His own life, and from the Cross said of His executioners. Father forgive them, they know not what they do. It is Jesus who wins the souls, if we are able to offer some sacrifice in union with His sufferings for us all. We can do nothing without Him. That is what I believe.
No. There is a lot of misinformation out there on the net. That is why I try to be very careful about what I post, but it is hard to avoid it entirely. I have been snookered an few times.
We all have at one time or another. I just am grateful that we have the freedom to try to find the actual truth of a matter these days rather than having the corp media spoon feed us the news like in days gone by.
This is true. I am also so glad to be a Catholic at this time so I have the means to filter all this information through Scripture and the Teachings of the Church to try and make some sense of it all. So many people have a bad agenda. Thanks God also for a good Catholic Education and a love of reading Catholic books when I was younger. A lot of this stuff would simply bury you, especially the Pagan and New Age stuff. We need fully trained Catholic minds, young Catholic minds more than ever in these days of utube mush.
Hi folks - so I thought I'd join the discussion and write some thoughts I have about our Pope - Enjoy! I read and hear a lot about, and by our Pope. I can certainly understand why many Catholics, especially conservative ones are concerned. So here's my thoughts on our Pope. To start with I don't call our Pope a good or a bad Pope - He's our Pope - full stop. And I certainly don't believe that our Pope is the 'Anti Pope' or even worse the Anti Christ' as I've read in some extreme quarters. Our Pope is the most connected Pope we've ever had - By this I mean he's connected our Church to a much wider audience than ever before, and he embraces various forms of media to do this. A little more on this in a moment. For me the things that resonate really well are the following: - He's and avid supporter of the Eucharist and thereby the mass - He's actively encourages people to go to confession (leading by example) and actively encourages the clergy to show God's mercy in this sacrament - He demonstrates a deep personal devotion to Our Lady - I personally feel he is trying to do good by pushing boundaries... So further to above, the key criticisms around our Pope relate to his attempts at widening the catholic audience and readdress some established rules. The synods and subsequent release of Amorim laetitia - specifically Chapter 8, and quotes such as 'If someone is gay, and he searches for the Lord and has good will, Who am I to judge?', have opened up a ton of discussion and confusion. He has denounced traditionalists, and yet at the same time is seemingly on the cusp of facilitating the reunification of SSPX into the Church (including playing a 'major role' in quickening the process for SSPX to purchase the Santa Maria Immacolata all’Esquilino in Rome). Our Pope has pushed other boundaries too - He moved into the Papal Guesthouse - or more tellingly, refused to live in the Papal apartments because they are too plush. He washed and kissed the feet of Muslim, Hindu, and Christian refugees. This type of pushing boundaries to extremes is apparently the modus operandi of Jesuit priests, and given this context, and some of his personal history having to live under a dictatorship in Argentina, I get a sense of his methods. I don't feel So - My overall personal feeling is that our Pope is pushing boundaries in a sincere effort to bring as many people as possible to a position where they can have an opportunity to save their soul. If you've read this far - thanks, and I look forward to your replies!
"Pushing boundaries" is good if the boundaries are bad. When the boundaries are 2000 years of magisterial teaching and Tradition "pushing boundaries" is no more than the PC term for heresy. Here's an example of faith in action from someone the Pope praises as a great theologian. Not a rigid, pharisaical fundamentalist in the house (or was it the Cathedral?): https://gloria.tv/language/S2mQ8XjTcSwL3q8noxk8XEbJo/video/DqZBEx2uKjdS6gni9jXUnMA74 If this is the way of the future under the guise of reaching out and pushing boundaries with "great theologians" guiding us, my response is "thanks, but no thanks". Many notorious heretics have been very sincere in their efforts to bring as many people as possible to a position where they can have an opportunity to save their soul. Sincere and correct have different meanings.
Teljam, all what you say is true and very nice. You touched on the qualities of this pope that we all have spoken of. What you seem to dodge and what is of great concern for many of the faithful, including high ranking Cardinals and Bishops, is that the pope has left open the reception of Holy Eucharist to those in objective grave sin. I would like to hear your perspective on this possibility.
Indeed. You don't have to be a traditionalist to be repulsed by that display. I suppose that posting the video could be seen as being out of place or OTT in a response to the points Teljam was making which is that sincerity doesn't excuse error. It will take more than personal popularity and being nice to the SSPX to convince me that Pope Francis is not the Honorius 1 of our day. Pope Honorius did some good things and brought some heretics back into the fold, but his refusal to condemn heresy eventually led to his own condemnation and the martyrdom of one of his successors. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07452b.htm
Hi Teljam, The idea that this pope is "pushing boundaries" is a curious one for me. Did not Jesus Christ "push boundaries" opening salvation to all? Of course, salvation is offered to all who "repent and believe". Is this the message of Pope Francis in his "pushing of the boundaries"? I think not, therefore I believe it is a "false pushing of those boundaries".
A 'youth Mass'. In the face of such condescension, it is unsurprising that young people are abandoning the Mass. A fool trying to be cool. There is nothing more cringeworthy for the young. The strongest magnet for young people seems to be the Extraordinary Form. Typically, this is another example of the Church never missing an opportunity to miss an opportunity-Pope Francis has condemned and insulted these young people for their 'nostalgia' for something they are too young to ever have had a possibility of experiencing.
Since the beginning of this pontificate, I have been troubled by the Pope failing to kneel at the Consecration of the Mass. Initially, it was suggested that he was unable to kneel because of age/infirmity. However he appears to have had little trouble kneeling before those whose feet he has washed on each Holy Thursday of his pontificate. During which he represents Our Lord washing the feet of his Apostles (not the feet of those who might have been unfortunate in their choices of religion or lifestyles but the feet of those who made the very best of choices by following Him and showing humility before His subordinates in office). Going to confession to receive understanding and encouragement in one's way of life (no-one is condemned for ever as Francis has assured us) is hardly the same as going to ensure that one does not suffer eternal condemnation which he denies. We are talking about two totally different attitudes to purpose and outcome of the Sacrament of Confession. How does he demonstrate his devotion to Our Lady by visiting Lund before any Marian shrine? (A very notable Eucharistic Miracle occurred in his own country when he was Auxiliary Bishop and so fully aware of this gift to the world, has he ever bothered to mention this at any time since becoming Pope?) Come on!
Thanks for the great replies folks. As they mostly relate to my 'pushing boundaries' thought, and more specifically relating to communion of those in sin (relating to divorced and/or remarried couples), I'll address this with MY take on it, as I didn't want to do a bunch of individual replies and come across as an ardent defender of our Pope. I'll also briefly address the comment relating to the Eucharistic miracle in Argentina. Re my 'Pushing boundaries' comments. I think it's fair to say that those who replied to this see this behaviour as a negative - which is fine. As I mentioned I don't see it this way. Whilst he has challenged us to think about this, I think it's important to look at his actual thinking based on what he's said. In an interview on a flight - When specifically asked by the interviewer about what he meant by showing mercy to the divorced and remarried he replied (and emphasised), "The key phrase used by the synod, which I'll take up again, is 'integrate' in the life of the Church the wounded families, remarried families, etc.". Thompson then asked, "Does that mean they can receive Communion?". To which our Pope replied "This is the last thing. Integrating in the Church doesn't mean receiving Communion.". In fact this example is why I think it can be seen as a positive. Before Pope Francis pushed this particular boundary, there was I would argue, many Catholics who are divorced/remarried, who have up until now stayed away from the Church. Pope Francis is essentially inviting these marginalised folks back into the Church, not to receive communion, but to participate again. And in the same breath, he's asking the Clergy to look at how they can integrate people like this back into the Church. The words he uses is "reintegration into Church life" - He does not say communion. Interestingly, and most recently, our Pope has perhaps gone even further to clarify this point in a recent meeting with Chilean Priests - there report can be read HERE - Note this is google translated but if you can read Spanish then apparently the message is even clearer. To summarise - He says no to communion for divorced/remarried. And finally re the commenter's disappointment that Francis does not mention the Eucharistic miracle he witnessed whilst he was Cardinal in Argentina. I don't quite understand the disappointment in that he doesn't talk about it. I don't think popes in general talk about miracles in trying to prove faith - it's why it's called faith. But having said this, it was Cardinal Bergoglio who ordered professional photographs be taken, and it was Cardinal Bergoglio who made the decision to have the material scientifically analysed - That's the actions of someone who is aware of the importance of doing things properly to prove this kind of phenomenon. All good my me. Thanks for the replies folks.
